Wrestling Then and Now

by J.C. Diese

J.C. DEISE: Could you give the readers who may not be familiar with you a little bit of background information?

STINKY THE GARBAGE MAN: I am not going to give my real name, as I work under a mask. I got my start in the mid-1990s in Phoenix, Arizona, and while I have not been as active as I want to be, I plan on a comeback and taking more bookings. I am looking at heading east into the New England area, as I have been in touch with some indy groups there. The pay not withstanding, I think I could have some good matches as I have seen tapes of this crew. Rick Silver, Julio Dinero, Joe Rules, Hubie Volk, Philly Madison, Hot Rocker, Zeig, Chocolate Boy Wonder--I think I could have a good bout with any of these people.

JCD: You have been a vocal critic of the sheets and fan sites, so why the interview if you hate them so much?

STGM: So I can say what I think of them, for one thing. I've listened to no end about wise guys running me down or other indys down and am sick of it. The biggest mistake the wrestling world ever made was breaking kayfabe and smartening up these people. The second biggest mistake was in treating the fans as equals and not marks. Now the smarks won't like this, and you know what, I don't care, because I don't like them either, for the most part. If this comment makes them mad, tell them to log off and not read further. I just get sick of people who don't know what they are talking about telling me how I have to wrestle a bout or how a promoter needs to run a show. If these sheet writers know so much, why don't they stop writing and running down what actual wrestlers are doing and run their own shows! You don't see people like Wade Keller, Bruce Mitchell, Evan Ginzburg, or Dave Meltzer running shows, do you? No, but they are great at knocking what others do and making a living off of the work of others! If they know so much, they should run shows themselves. Otherwise they and their followers need to shut their damned mouths and leave wrestling to the pros! They all need to go back to being marks again, but thanks to the WWE smartening anyone who will listen and all the books out now, that will never happen. The wrestling world as I prefer it is a dead issue. I am stuck with what is left, and just because that's the way it is, doesn't mean I have to like it! No, I want the readers to hear me and hear me clear! All you self-proclaimed experts don't have a clue, so shut the hell up, and that includes these major sheet writers like Keller and Meltzer. You aren't wrestlers, you're just hyped-up parrots repeating what other people tell you. Maybe Brian Alvarez has a little more background to be a critic, as he is or was an indy wrestler, but the rest of them are just smart marks with too high an opinion of themselves and no clue what this business is about or how hard it is. None of them could survive in a ring, so they have no business knocking us who are up there.

JCD: Many disagree with you, I am sure.

STGM: So what? Let them. I get sick of this catering to the fans. It's what's killing off wrestling. Too many wrestlers worry about what the Observer or Wrestling- Then & Now might say about them and not enough about the paying customers at the live shows. They're the ones who count, not wise guys who are 2,000 miles away.

JCD: Some might accuse you of ripping off Duke "The Dumpster" Droese with your role.

STGM: Again, proving most smarks don't have a clue and shoot their mouths off without knowing the facts. I was given this name at a Phoenix show, by the booker. There was a promotional war going on between Phoenix and Tucson, and he wanted me to be used to take a slight stab at the Tucson crew. He billed me as Stinky The Garbage Man, from TUCSON, implying of course that their wrestlers were garbage--which frankly, they were. I didn't get to win any matches either, for obvious reasons.

JCD: Yet you kept the name and mask?

STGM: Actually, yes I did, as I thought the routine would make me look like a fool, but it got a lot of heat. I had fans chanting, "Stinky stinks," which I thought was hilarious. What started as a joke ended up being a routine.

JCD: You don't do hardcore or extreme wrestling?

STGM: No, because that's what so many of these stupid sheet smarks want. I don't jump off of balconies or do triple moonsaults, as to me, it looks stupid. It doesn't look believable. I do on-the-mat wrestling, some brawling, and holds. Some of the young punks think it's boring, but older fans have loved it, as it is a throwback to the days when wrestlers wrestled and didn't do entertainment, like in the WWE.

JCD: You've also been a critic of the WWE.

STGM: Sure I have, as no single promotion has done more to destroy wrestling as many of us knew and loved it than the McMahons. They have made money, for sure, but have turned the business into a high profile laughingstock. Plus they exposed the business to everyone. It sickens me, as I would prefer to kayfabe, but you can't anymore, because even little kids know you are lying. The WWE destroyed wrestling and bastardized it to make a profit off the revamped crap they run now. And what scares me is many people DO like this! The people have developed a taste for this garbage, and that scares me. Fans of this crap should stay away from my matches, because I don't do this stuff. I hate the WWE and all it stands for. I wouldn't go there, even if they used me, which I am sure they wouldn't, and I am glad for it!

JCD: You prefer indys?

STGM: Yes, and one reason is crowd reaction. At smaller indy shows, you can still work the crowd, pick out individuals and have exchanges with them, get heat by working the public, and things that just don't happen any longer at WWE shows. The indys are the only throwback to wrestling as it used to be, and that's what I want.

JCD: Have you noticed any steroid or drug problems in wrestling?

STGM: Not so much among indys, but in the big time it is obvious. While I do not put stock in the Observer, I read that stupid Tributes book, and note how many deaths have been drug related, yet brushed under the carpet. That's one of the few accurate things, I think, in that bullshit book. Now Hennig and Elizabeth are gone too. It's a spiral, and the wrestling world doesn't seem to be doing anything about it! Drugs in wrestling? It's obvious it is a big problem, at least in some places. Not so much in my area, though. There have been some people who use marijuana or coke, and I won't name them, but not many. Drinking is more popular in the west.

JCD: What's it like in the west now?

STGM: Many of the older and better promoters are gone and have been replaced by really bad ones, which is why I plan to head east. You have several people running in Texas, Arizona, and California, but many of these people are right out of the backyard. The Mexican border isn't what it used to be. You used to be able to go down to San Luis Rio Colorado, Nogales, or Agua Prieta and always find work, but not so much now. Most of their wrestlers who were once draws are retired or gone now, like Los Mercenarios, Mil Mascaras, Bucky Zepeda, Mr. Majestyk, Golgatha, Centrella Negra, Anibal, and the like, and like in the USA, they have been replaced by punks and know-it-alls who really know nothing. So right now, things are on the downswing. More people running, but running with garbage and presenting total crap.

JCD: Who are you talking with for the east?

STGM: A couple groups. Joe Rules seems like a decent indy guy, and I think he and I could have some good bouts or work as a team. There are some others. You'll see and we'll see.

JCD: Do you have a Web page?

STGM: No. I hate the Internet. Breeding ground for vipers and liers and a bunch of mornic, lifeless, clueless smarks, like I said before.

JCD: Aren't you going to be in a book?

STGM: Yeah, a photo and bio, but nothing more. The Wrestling Picture Gallery, $4.95 plus $1.50 mailing by Alternative Publishing, oddly enough, run by one of the Wrestling- Then & Now people, a guy named Jeff Archer. Archer also did an expose book which I was not fond of, but the fans thought it was great, called Theatre in a Squared Circle. Still, I have no direct contact with the guy, so there's no problem. I didn't write the book, I just knew a friend who knew someone who was doing it and had pull to get into it. I think I have the e-mail for the publisher. LekkerSpikkels@msn.com, I think. Archer is the one doing the book--I mean publishing it--but he did not write it. So don't bother him about my opinions in this interview. Just write him if you want to find out about the book. If you don't want to read about me, then piss on you, don't order a copy. I could care less, as I am making no money off it, just press. And if that Ginzburg guy finds out about the book and reads this interview, it may even cause a rift between him and his printer, but you know what? It's of no concern to me.

JCD: What attracted you to some of these eastern indys anyway?

STGM: I saw video tapes, then started talking to some of these people on the phone. Rick Silver throws one wicked punch, one of the best I have ever seen. I was laughing at this guy when I first saw him on video, then he threw punches and it was like, "Ha, ha--huh? Jesus!" I know people who have been around twenty years who can't do a punch like this. Then we have Joe Rules, who to me is a toss-back to the old-style heels like I grew up watching. Others too, like Mr. Ooh La La, really impress me. I am not sure if he is around, but again, he reminded me of those old-style/foolish heels like say Bull Ramos or John Ringer or The Time Traveler. I learned not all of the east is hardcore and blood, with no rhyme or reason. Amid all the garbage, to make a pun, they have some good groups. Sadly, it is not these groups that are getting all the attention.

JCD: You claim to be a bitter opponent of those exposing the business, but don't you feel a bit silly doing so yourself in this talk?

STGM: Yes, but what can I say or do? The very nature of the wrestling world any more will not allow you to kayfabe. If I gave a straight shoot interview here, no one would read it, because what you have here is other workers or smarks all logging on, all of them wised up, and they are next to impossible to work, so I have to talk out of school to get some of my points across, or not at all. At house shows and on the mike, I always treat the business as a straight shoot. If people approach me face to face and try to talk wise to me, I will kayfabe them even if they don't buy it, when at a house show. It is, by the way, a great way to still get heat as nothing makes the smarks madder when you deal with them and try to treat them like marks. Sadly, the wrestling business is so exposed and overexposed, there is no way it can ever go back to the good old days. So we have to make do, but that doesn't mean I need to like it and doesn't mean I have to cater to the fans.

JCD: Have you developed a finishing hold?

STGM: Not really, but when I am winning and about to end it, I try to yell, "Time to take out the trash!" Then I just do whatever seems like a good idea to do and end it. I like using outmoded holds because again, it pisses the smarks off, you know, things like a sleeper, a claw, or an abdominal stretch, as opposed to the spectacular things a lot of people want you to do. Hey, that's why I like heeling. I don't have to be nice to people.

JCD: What advice would you give someone wanting to get into wrestling?

STGM: Don't. But if you have to . . . trust no one. Never take anything for granted, and beware of people charging you money for training and making promises that won't be delivered. For example, it is very unlikely some nobody running a school in say Tucson or Prescott or Butthole County, who has never been in the WWE himself, will be able to get you booked in the WWE. You have a load of people willing to take aspirants and wannabes to the cleaners. If you must wrestle, be real careful who you deal with. Trust no one and never take anything as gospel. There are of course other options, like some of these backyarders in Phoenix and Tucson have done, renting a ring and just running, without any real training or experience, which results in a crappy show and I hate it, but it is an option some take. It can be a dangerous one, but an option, nonetheless. Working untrained is a great way to get hurt or hurt someone. It's also a great way for having someone like me kick your ass, if you get on a real show, come across as a know-it-all, and don't know a damned thing! So my advice to people who want to get in, is don't do it, as it's a garbage life! If you must, be very careful and calculating. Don't trust anyone. It's a cut-throat business.

JCD: Then why stay?

STGM: I didn't know how bad it would be when I started, in spite of warnings, but once you get in, you get addicted, in spite of the drawbacks. It's like being a drug addict.

JCD: Closing comments?

STGM: I am sure this interview will make a lot of people mad. Ask me if I care!

JCD: Do you care if this interview makes people mad?


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