Present:
Sandman
Thorrn
Zoran
Rollo the Ax
Bretval
Venator
Austin
Master of one
larissa
nyla
natasha
ruby
atiya
flicka
OriginalSandman_Builder/ Sr. Captain of GS 19:42:20 pm CDT
ok folks let's get started with forum,, PM me topics
keep the chatter in pm's and as always
agree or disagree show respect.
If I am urted I would like to ask my Brother Rollo to keep things moving or Friend Zoran if Brother Rollo has to leave
Zoran Merchant ~Mentor~ 19:43:45 pm CDT
Nods to Sandman
ruby~{Randolph}~t 19:45:04 pm CDT
dark gems lift to Master Sandman...listens intently
flicka~ slave of Keeper. ~GS~ fg. 19:46:14 pm CDT
~attention is focussed on Master Sandman.~
Rollo the Ax 19:46:52 pm CDT
I will remain, brother Sandman.. if the need should come up.....
OriginalSandman_Builder/ Sr. Captain of GS 19:47:08 pm CDT
waving to the man, my old friend Zoran has an announcement
larissa{Austin} 19:49:03 pm CDT
golden browns turn towards Master Zoran as she listens intently to the Master.
natasha{Zoran} 19:49:40 pm CDT
leans forward, listening intently
Zoran Merchant ~Mentor~ 19:50:11 pm CDT
As flicka said I will be running the sparing in the festival
I have had some volunteers but if there are any new masters want to spar
Please whisper me or get in touch with me at
Sirlexx@hotmail.com
flicka~ slave of Keeper. ~GS~ fg. 19:51:08 pm CDT
~tried to hide the chuckle at Master Zoran's email addy.~
Zoran Merchant ~Mentor~ 19:53:13 pm CDT
Thank you Sandman
OriginalSandman_Builder/ Sr. Captain of GS 19:55:19 pm CDT
no do any have topics?
OriginalSandman_Builder/ Sr. Captain of GS 20:02:34 pm CDT
now we have a topic:
Rank, power, title, or position …. Who better deserves any of these … the man/person given then by others freely…. or he that feels that he has earned or deserves them
ruby~{Randolph}~t 20:07:23 pm CDT
taps fingers to chin.- pondering the topic
Rollo the Ax 20:07:40 pm CDT
For my position... the Elder Edda states ** men die, all that remains of them is their good name and regard that other hold them in while they lived **
Bretval {meral}: Scribe~ Warrior~Merchant 20:08:58 pm CDT
Interesting question Captain.... I would ask what has He done to earn any of the above
Master of one - Owner of torri 20:09:26 pm CDT
He who seeks none of those things is the one who deserves them most....
Austin - Scholar- 20:11:59 pm CDT
A humbled person often never feels he has earned a position.. the position and respect comes from other who watch.. observed .. evaluate .. and then offer the position or recognition.. To me the one who thinks He has earned his position or recognition.. is often over evaluating himself.. It is good to be self confident but to think yourself yo have earned it.. is like over looking an opponent in a contest.. and before all what you thought you believed is not the same as others..
flicka~ slave of Keeper. ~GS~ fg. 20:12:06 pm CDT
"Rank, power, title, or position …. Who better deserves any of these … the man/person given then by others freely…. or he that feels that he has earned or deserves them "
as a slave flicka has none of these nor does she seek them. But as always flicka does have thoughts on the matter.
Unless they are given freely by others to flicka's mind they are meaningless.
Having said that it is others who judge whether or not a man has earned and thus deserves honouring. For flicka rank, title, power or position that is a man's by birthright is an empty privileged, worthless.
larissa{Austin} 20:12:15 pm CDT
smiles and listens to the Masters discuss the topic at hand.
atiya{GS} please speak out for those too afraid to speak 20:13:27 pm CDT
sits and listens to the Masters talk
Rollo the Ax 20:13:49 pm CDT
Basically my opinion also, Mo1 .... a man does what he does for duty, free will, or simply because it needs done.... not only if in doing so will bring him power, position, or wealth.....
Austin - Scholar- 20:14:28 pm CDT
better said by One
ruby~{Randolph}~t 20:14:33 pm CDT
nodding agreeing with Master Austin's wise assessment
OriginalSandman_Builder/ Sr. Captain of GS 20:15:08 pm CDT
better I think is the man who regarded with respect by his peers ,, than a man who has convinced himself he has earned honor or accolades
Venator-Warrior 20:15:35 pm CDT
Nods, people follow those that provide a path. Having been there and done that.
Master of one - Owner of torri 20:15:50 pm CDT
He who doesn't seek rank, title, or power acts according to His own moral compass...
Venator-Warrior 20:16:50 pm CDT
Nods, it is the course, not the title that steers your path.
flicka~ slave of Keeper. ~GS~ fg. 20:17:00 pm CDT
~smiling at the words of Master of one.~ How many have a clear moral compass a girl wonders.
larissa{Austin} 20:17:41 pm CDT
admires all the Master's and their brilliant thoughts...
atiya{GS} please speak out for those too afraid to speak 20:18:12 pm CDT
~curls a leg under her and hugs her knee as she listens~
Bretval {meral}: Scribe~ Warrior~Merchant 20:18:29 pm CDT
Acts not words... but in time unrecognized acts bring an end to acts...
Master of one - Owner of torri 20:18:31 pm CDT
Yes Venator
Not in the way He thinks will bring Him rank, title, and power But in the path He feels is right in His heart
Rollo the Ax 20:19:08 pm CDT
In one way of explaining or giving an example...... in the OLD days of GS... the Council of Captains was always in need of help or others to become Council members.... we had a standing * rule * or understanding that we decided who by what they did and said... any man that came saying * I have been around long enough or deserve to become a Council member and Captain *..... we dismissed these men off hand.......
Venator-Warrior 20:19:15 pm CDT
Agrees with Master of one. Nods.
Austin - Scholar- 20:19:32 pm CDT
Heroism often comes from a humble person who says I was just doing what needed to be done.. I never tried to be a hero.. That attitude also give one position and respect in the eyes of those the hero is around... so many Heros just don't even want to talk about it.. that was a common thought and attitude in the earthen's Greatest Generation..
OriginalSandman_Builder/ Sr. Captain of GS 20:20:13 pm CDT
well said Austin
ruby~{Randolph}~t 20:20:17 pm CDT
also believes a Free must have a sense of worth for Himself...it is often said a Master must be able to Master Himself before guiding Others
OriginalSandman_Builder/ Sr. Captain of GS 20:20:47 pm CDT
smiling Rollo I was taught that lesson by my mentors
Master of one - Owner of torri 20:21:48 pm CDT
if acts end because of lack of recognition, then I question the motive of such acts
Venator-Warrior 20:22:41 pm CDT
An internal compass is the best compass of all.
Austin - Scholar- 20:22:53 pm CDT
Well said Rollo..
atiya{GS} please speak out for those too afraid to speak 20:22:54 pm CDT
that is very true ruby
Rollo the Ax 20:23:19 pm CDT
Exactly, Mo1 ...... well said ....
Rollo the Ax 20:25:33 pm CDT
Well folks....... I can only offer what I have seen in my life... back in the day, the guys that acted all tough and talked the talk, seldom were able to walk the walk when the shit hit the fan .....
Rollo the Ax 20:27:26 pm CDT
Like our officers.... no job too big or costly... as long as they lead from the rear and it was the grunts dying and not the brass.....
Master of one - Owner of torri 20:27:32 pm CDT
I have a quote that sits on My desk....
A person does not set out to be a leader, but becomes one by the quality of one's actions and the integrity of one's intent. In the end, leaders are much like eagles...they don't flock, you find them one at a time.
Venator-Warrior 20:28:46 pm CDT
Aye, Master of one. A good lesson.
ruby~{Randolph}~t 20:29:38 pm CDT
Master of one
Who wrote that quote?... its very astute
Rollo the Ax 20:30:16 pm CDT
Very apt saying Mo1....
Master of one - Owner of torri 20:31:28 pm CDT
I don't know ruby....
~ smiles
It's on My pen/pencil holder
Rollo the Ax 20:38:02 pm CDT
If Sandman has gone, please feel free to PM me any new or different topics.....
flicka~ slave of Keeper. ~GS~ fg. 20:40:13 pm CDT
did the demon just bite?
Bretval {meral}: Scribe~ Warrior~Merchant 20:41:21 pm CDT
It did flicka... Time Warp
Austin - Scholar- 20:41:36 pm CDT
Great quote One
Rollo the Ax 20:43:24 pm CDT
LOL... the trick is to have a big enough butt to get bit and keep going..... LOL..
flicka~ slave of Keeper. ~GS~ fg. 20:43:52 pm CDT
No Master Bretval ,that is so bad of You, now flicka will be humming "The Time Warp" all day and dancing it. ~chuckling~
Master of one - Owner of torri 20:43:53 pm CDT
Damned daemon urt
Bretval {meral}: Scribe~ Warrior~Merchant 20:45:22 pm CDT
*LOL* True, flicka... now it is My head as well
Rollo the Ax 20:45:40 pm CDT
Just a jump to the left hey, flicka ?? LOL...
flicka~ slave of Keeper. ~GS~ fg. 20:47:46 pm CDT
Don't Master Rollo! it is one of Jarl Keeper's favs, he gets His classes to do it and He does it with them and then comes home complaining of His aching back.
Rollo the Ax 20:48:47 pm CDT
Okay folks.. we have another topic if everybody is done with this topic and dancing .....LOL...LOL...
ruby~{Randolph}~t 20:49:19 pm CDT
settles and listens
flicka~ slave of Keeper. ~GS~ fg. 20:49:59 pm CDT
dancing is very dear to the hearts of we kajira Master Rollo. ~lowering her eyes`
Rollo the Ax 20:50:40 pm CDT
A new topic .... What happens if and when punishment is taken too far for the level of the crime or infraction ?? Say a slave spilled a drink on a Masters shoes ?? does she deserve harsh words ? a swift single cuffing ? kicked to the floor and the boot put to her well and truly ? posted and whipped until bloody and broken ?? different offence…… said slave seems to ignore or not hear, a Masters instructions or orders ?? strong words ?? slapped and or cuffed?? Kicked or beaten ?? killed ?? When punishment is taken to a level above and beyond what seems just or reasonable…. Is it done to punish or help train the slave, or is it done simply because the said * Master * enjoys inflicting pain on others or revels in the abject fear they cause.. ??
Master of one - Owner of torri 20:53:16 pm CDT
For a real 'Master' the punishment fits the crime and the slave to some degree....but it should never go to extremes...it damages the girl in many ways
atiya{GS} please speak out for those too afraid to speak 20:53:54 pm CDT
~hugs herself listening~
ruby~{Randolph}~t 20:54:19 pm CDT
to girl thats easy
what ever a Master deems appropriate..if the slave is His property
if a GS slave..cage or tie to the post..and contact the Captains
Gor is harsh...a slave should always taste the bite of fear she may be found displeasing
nyla{James} 20:55:05 pm CDT
*listens quietly*
Master of one - Owner of torri 20:56:02 pm CDT
True ruby but that can be taken too far
atiya{GS} please speak out for those too afraid to speak 20:56:22 pm CDT
aye Master, way too far
Master of one - Owner of torri 20:57:20 pm CDT
Surely you don't condone being abusive just because I am Master
Rollo the Ax 20:57:32 pm CDT
The point I feel is * punishment * should remain at a level logical for the crime or offence...
flicka~ slave of Keeper. ~GS~ fg. 20:58:28 pm CDT
On Gor a Master's word is law. As ruby has said if the slave is His property he may do as he wishes. If the slave belongs to Another He may still do as He wishes and reap whatever consequences the slave's Owner wishes to pursue.
As to the reason for the level of punishment, that is not flicka's place to comment upon.
atiya{GS} please speak out for those too afraid to speak 20:58:29 pm CDT
~shivers hugging herself~
ruby~{Randolph}~t 20:59:19 pm CDT
Master of one
was that directed to girl..?
larissa{Austin} 21:00:19 pm CDT
agrees with ruby and mistress, it is the personal slaves Master who decides if the punishment fits the crime, and to what extent. there are far worse punishments then being whipped, each girl knows what is the worse thing a Master can do to them to break them.
Rollo the Ax 21:00:23 pm CDT
I think that was one of the points of the question, Mo1... a master is NOT a monster....
Master of one - Owner of torri 21:00:40 pm CDT
No, ruby it was just a general question
Bretval {meral}: Scribe~ Warrior~Merchant 21:00:54 pm CDT
In the end is up to the Master of the personal slave
and up to the Captains of GS... as ruby says the cage or post...
for little things a harsh word and look can be sufficient...
Master of one - Owner of torri 21:01:17 pm CDT
Agreed Rollo
atiya{GS} please speak out for those too afraid to speak 21:01:33 pm CDT
a Master who cannot control himself should not be a Master, but that's this one's lowly opinion. it's not directed at anyone here though
flicka~ slave of Keeper. ~GS~ fg. 21:03:07 pm CDT
atiya that is a value judgement that only a Master's peers or the Council of Captains could make a judgement upon.
Master of one - Owner of torri 21:03:12 pm CDT
Well said atiya
Rollo the Ax 21:03:21 pm CDT
case in point... Why would a woman come to Gor to explore her slavery.. when that kind of * bad * master makes it as bad or worse that domestic violence in RT
ruby~{Randolph}~t 21:03:49 pm CDT
true mistress
a Masters word is law, there should be no negotiation
even in the books..it says Masters do not abuse...it was not in Their nature...They learned Their slaves well..and in doing so, the slave was more under Their mercy
Rollo the Ax 21:05:09 pm CDT
very true, atiya......
atiya{GS} please speak out for those too afraid to speak 21:05:38 pm CDT
the girls here, Master, don't know what it's like to be slapped an strangled, to see that look shudders if he can't control himself he doesn't deserve the title Master
Master of one - Owner of torri 21:05:41 pm CDT
True Rollo, but the basic tenant here is that bad master can do that to any slave.... And that is where I have a problem
flicka~ slave of Keeper. ~GS~ fg. 21:07:01 pm CDT
Exactly ruby, and contrary to the thought that a slave was only worth a single copper, a trained slave was worth much more than that to her Master. Why would anyone damage a commodity for no good reason. Same with over the top and damaging punishment.
And so once more it reverts to what is a Good Master. But also what is a good slave, some are not worth the energy or time being spent upon them. A good Master knows when to discard.
Rollo the Ax 21:08:00 pm CDT
You know a strange point... ( I would have said funny, but there is nothing funny about it...) until just the last few years, there were stronger laws against animal abuse than against wife beating or abuse ......
Bretval {meral}: Scribe~ Warrior~Merchant 21:08:17 pm CDT
Then He better not do it in front of Me... particularly with a GS slave ...
or any slave that is not His....
ruby~{Randolph}~t 21:08:26 pm CDT
well stated mistress...nodding
atiya{GS} please speak out for those too afraid to speak 21:08:46 pm CDT
domestic violence Master is still a misdemeanor, sad as it is
flicka~ slave of Keeper. ~GS~ fg. 21:09:19 pm CDT
~nodding to Master Rollo~ And now at least in our country Master Rollo great effort is being made to address that situation.
larissa{Austin} 21:09:40 pm CDT
but how far can a slave push a Master. some slaves will push those limits..
Master of one - Owner of torri 21:10:40 pm CDT
I will go so far as any slave period Bretval
I'm far from a night in shining armor but I'll be damned if I stand by idly and watch that... It is up to Us, the real Masters to defend the weak and those that can't defend themselves
ruby~{Randolph}~t 21:11:43 pm CDT
larissa
ruby can only speak for herself
if she ever...and means ever pushed her Jarl...things would get very ugly...very quick
Bretval {meral}: Scribe~ Warrior~Merchant 21:11:47 pm CDT
That always depends on the Master, larissa...
Rollo the Ax 21:12:43 pm CDT
That is one of the reasons I feel that Goreans have to wear such a bad rep with many ... because the terms * slave * and * punishment * are used, they all think we are a bunch of abusive bastards that get off beating slaves and killing them......
larissa{Austin} 21:12:53 pm CDT
nods and agrees with ruby, and knows if larissa acted out anything but a playful manor, Master Austin would have this girl's hide...
Venator-Warrior 21:13:10 pm CDT
Nods, agrees with Master of one. There is a reasonable response to each action.
flicka~ slave of Keeper. ~GS~ fg. 21:13:21 pm CDT
larissa, Master of one, a girl is supposing we are speaking of a slave "pushing" a Master in Who's collar she is not. Sorry convoluted sentence.
In Gorean Shores that Master should and does, either chain the slave to the whipping post or cages her, He then apprises the slave's Master of her conduct and the Owner of the girl addresses the problem.
IF the Master Who has done the caging is not satisfied with the outcome, then He takes the matter up Master to Master and They resolve it as honourable Gorean Men.
atiya{GS} please speak out for those too afraid to speak 21:13:58 pm CDT
but ruby it shouldn't be to the point of being in abject fear of him, where you run in the other direction,and I do mean RUN, when you see him
Master of one - Owner of torri 21:14:45 pm CDT
No flicka, that is what He should do.... What he can do is as he wishes....
Master of one - Owner of torri 21:15:47 pm CDT
~ breaking the rules becoming a lowly scofflaw
Tal Captain Thorrn
Good to see you
Bretval {meral}: Scribe~ Warrior~Merchant 21:16:02 pm CDT
I agree totally #One... but is does become dicey with personal slave... the girl might be a pain slut and is getting exactly what she wants from her Master... it is never wise to interfere between a Master and His personal slave
Master of one - Owner of torri 21:17:09 pm CDT
And that should be done privately then Bretval
flicka~ slave of Keeper. ~GS~ fg. 21:17:23 pm CDT
~nodding and nodding~ And Master of one, in our home if a Master overstepped those boundaries the Other Pledged Masters and the Captains would address it.
Even to the extent of banning Him if necessary. And yes if another Master saw a Master overstepping the boundaries, then a girl would hope that they would intervene.
larissa{Austin} 21:17:25 pm CDT
Master Bretval, but that would fall under funishment and not punishment.. being ignored and tossed aside can be far worse for slaves then a Master realizes.
ruby~{Randolph}~t 21:18:19 pm CDT
Master Bretval
humbly disagrees
even a pain slut knows the difference..nodding firmly
Master of one - Owner of torri 21:18:35 pm CDT
And I agree it's not wise but will error as My moral compass directs Me and deal with the consequence....
atiya{GS} please speak out for those too afraid to speak 21:18:47 pm CDT
until a few weeks ago, this one was a personal slave, in RL, and learned the lesson hard
Thorrn, Captain & Slavemaster 21:19:20 pm CDT
MoO
One can try to trust someone else knowing what He does with His slave - and the slave knowing what Master she trusted when she accepted the collar.
It is seldom good to interfere between a Master and His slave.
and thanks for the welcome
ruby~{Randolph}~t 21:21:15 pm CDT
there are Many quotes in the books
to not interfere in the business of a Master and His property
Master of one - Owner of torri 21:21:26 pm CDT
But flicka.... Again, a Master should not intervene. Isn't that what you said earlier? ......and how much is a girl damaged if this happens even once before the Council acts....
Again Wwe aren't talking punishment, Wwe are talking abuse
larissa{Austin} 21:22:21 pm CDT
looks to Master of one is it rt abuse or ct abuse?
Master of one - Owner of torri 21:22:24 pm CDT
Sorry....this is a very touchy subject with Me.... And one of the struggles I have with Gor and said moral compass
flicka~ slave of Keeper. ~GS~ fg. 21:22:36 pm CDT
No Master of one, a girl was still speaking of if it were not the Master's own slave. But the slave of another and he was breaking the girl's restrictions.
Master of one - Owner of torri 21:22:51 pm CDT
To some larissa, they are one and the same
Bretval {meral}: Scribe~ Warrior~Merchant 21:22:52 pm CDT
I agree ruby I truly do... but if the girl stays with the Master how can We judge... I may not like it... and if the girl came to Me for help I would do what I can but it is not possible to make quick judgements without the whole story...
Thorrn, Captain & Slavemaster 21:23:23 pm CDT
Thank you for all the nice welcome *bright smile*
The souls , hearts and needs of slaves can be very different and they have a broad span of what a slave seeks in a collar. So it is mostly wise to watch and keep the mouth shut when one does not understand at once.
atiya{GS} please speak out for those too afraid to speak 21:24:09 pm CDT
I brought up to Master Rollo of RL abuse, larissa
flicka~ slave of Keeper. ~GS~ fg. 21:24:41 pm CDT
Sad as it may be, some girls are in the collar of Masters who others would deem abusive. But the Master of that girl has all rights and all power.
Thorrn, Captain & Slavemaster 21:26:22 pm CDT
In here - a virtual world - a slave can leave a Master when she gets abused and doesn´t want to stay in His collar anymore.
atiya{GS} please speak out for those too afraid to speak 21:27:10 pm CDT
leaving is not so easy in RL Jarl
Thorrn, Captain & Slavemaster 21:27:40 pm CDT
What is RL, atiya?
Rollo the Ax 21:28:15 pm CDT
There still remains the question or perhaps lack of question .... no matter if the girl is some sort of * pain puppy * or LIKES to be hurt.... ( as strange as that sounds ..... ) to allow it to happen right in front of us makes it look like we condone it....... and we DO NOT !!!!!
flicka~ slave of Keeper. ~GS~ fg. 21:28:27 pm CDT
atiya we are not speaking of real life, we are speaking of a fantasy world online.
atiya{GS} please speak out for those too afraid to speak 21:28:45 pm CDT
real life, Jarl, my apologies
atiya{GS} please speak out for those too afraid to speak 21:29:28 pm CDT
I know flicka, but there are some that do both
Thorrn, Captain & Slavemaster 21:30:42 pm CDT
This is not BDSM so we don´t practice public habits of BDSM or Masosadism.
But if this plays a role in the relationship between a Master and His slave it doesn´t mean abuse.
Rollo the Ax 21:31:10 pm CDT
It is time to call an end to this weeks forum... my last words are these.... on the topic of abuse, I feel that it is a FAMILY matter at times.... when my daughter got married, right after the ceremony I told the new husband that she was HIS to take care of.... but if I EVER heard one word of violence or abuse his body parts would NEVER be found.....
flicka~ slave of Keeper. ~GS~ fg. 21:31:19 pm CDT
aye atiya there are. ~softly` flicka lives with Jarl Keeper.
Thorrn, Captain & Slavemaster 21:31:31 pm CDT
atiya - ok, that is why i said - in virtual life.
In RL things are mostly not so easy like in virtual life *l*
flicka~ slave of Keeper. ~GS~ fg. 21:32:48 pm CDT
Thank You Master Rollo for stepping up to the ~wicked smile` batting crease after Master Sandman had to leave.
Rollo the Ax 21:32:53 pm CDT
Thorrn, I must take my leave now.... appointment I need to go to... if you would take over and end the forum please
Thorrn, Captain & Slavemaster 21:33:32 pm CDT
nods Rollo, sure i will do so.
ruby~{Randolph}~t 21:34:01 pm CDT
girl thanks Master Sandman and Jarl Rollo for leading
mistress flicka
thank you for scribing
Bretval {meral}: Scribe~ Warrior~Merchant 21:34:03 pm CDT
I do agree with that, Rollo... He takes it to a private room
atiya{GS} please speak out for those too afraid to speak 21:34:18 pm CDT
sorry, I just thought it would be a good topic as domestic violence awareness in October. sorry I brought it up
Rollo the Ax 21:34:42 pm CDT
Thanks to everybody for taking part in this weeks forum... and as always, thanks to flicka for scribing..... be well, all ........
Thorrn, Captain & Slavemaster 21:36:18 pm CDT
atiya, no need to feel sorry.
Such things are a matter in chat places like Gorean Shores or in the DM of poolside where many of the people also chat.
It never harms to get things straight again and have some thoughts about this to clear up doubts.
atiya{GS} please speak out for those too afraid to speak 21:38:03 pm CDT
I have been thru 2 marriages with this Jarl, I don't want any girl here to go thru what I did
Thorrn, Captain & Slavemaster 21:39:51 pm CDT
be well ruby *S*S*
atiya, we never can give our experiences to others, that just doesn´t work.
Thorrn, Captain & Slavemaster 21:41:29 pm CDT
Anymore topics to discuss, it looks like the forum losses the takers *l*
Bretval {meral}: Scribe~ Warrior~Merchant 21:42:49 pm CDT
Nothing more from Me Captain
Thorrn, Captain & Slavemaster 21:43:18 pm CDT
Nods to the Man, than i will close forum now Bretval.
Thorrn, Captain & Slavemaster 21:44:10 pm CDT
Thank you to Sandman and Rollo for doing the work tonight.
Thank you to flicka for scribing?
Thank you to A/all who took part in the discussion.
Bretval {meral}: Scribe~ Warrior~Merchant 21:44:54 pm CDT
My thanks for taking over Captain
and My thanks to flicka for scribing once again
