Present:

Sandman
Rollo The Ax.
Bretval
SaBom
Raiko
Lita

ruby
marieve
maddi-anne
leatha
flicka

Rollo the Ax 19:46:26 pm CST
Sandman left, so I guess I will try to get things rolling ....... does anybody have any topics they wish

discussed questions answered ?? rumours told or heard ?? hell, anything y'all want to talk about ......

SaBom 19:47:14 pm CST
~thinks the slave fur must be extra large for tonight's forum

flicka~ slave of Jarl Keeper. 19:48:38 pm CST
~tips a wink at Master SaBom, wondering if He thinks that we slaves are a tad too well fed~

marieve{GS}t 19:49:19 pm CST
~glancing up as Master Rollo gets things rolling~

SaBom 19:49:26 pm CST
lol.... not at all flicka... there are just so many of you tonight

Rollo the Ax 19:49:55 pm CST
It is not Gorean, but I have wondered any here have noted an increase with on-line BDSM interest due to

that Fifty shades movie ?

flicka~ slave of Jarl Keeper. 19:50:06 pm CST
~chuckling~ A diplomatic response Master SaBom. A girl applauds You.

maddie~anne{T§} 19:50:35 pm CST
~giggles as she spreads her knees a little wider, bumping against her sisters and smiling sweetly~ oh,
there is plenty of room, Master SaBom...

SaBom 19:51:00 pm CST
Did you expect any other kind

Lita, Physician 19:51:18 pm CST
Alas, I have no topic this night, The place where I get them had none. There were a couple I sent to the
Forum E-mail, Perhaps I can find one of those.

flicka~ slave of Jarl Keeper. 19:51:24 pm CST
Well Master Rollo, flicka doesn't know about the movie, but when the book came out and Jarl and flicka
were in the "toy" shop, the woman there said that had been an upsurge in the sale of BDsm toys.

leatha {GS} 19:51:33 pm CST
draws all attention to Master Rollo

marieve{GS}t 19:53:40 pm CST
marieve has read the fifty shade of grey book and enjoyed them. she looks forward to seeing the movie.
~grin~

ruby~{Randolph} 19:54:06 pm CST
Master Rollo
thinking most of the BDSM community is mocking the movie..as They did the books

SaBom 19:54:09 pm CST
I would think Rollo, based on book sales and movie ticket presales that there would almost have to be.

Bretval: Scribe~Warrior~Merchant 19:54:36 pm CST
A general acceptance by the media to the idea, perhaps... but North Americans are so uptight about sex
who knows what they really think

Lita, Physician 19:55:27 pm CST
Ah. I found one!@

marieve{GS}t 19:55:37 pm CST
many of a girls' r/t vanilla friends liked the books.

Rollo the Ax 19:56:10 pm CST
I would expect nothing less, flicka..... I have nor read them nor seen the movie.... I just expected a natural
increase in RT and VT interest...... far too many folks let social ideals limit their actions.... but let it come
out in a movie , and you will see every tom , dick, and harry wanting to * LOOK COOL * with bondage
gear and such......

flicka~ slave of Jarl Keeper. 19:57:21 pm CST
~chuckling~ ah so that is why they were sold out of all the "good" toys Master Rollo.

leatha {GS} 19:57:25 pm CST
leatha finds the books to be slightly off a little with BDSM. but, girl shall say it has given the ladies of
Earth to open up their minds to others ways of pleasure.

maddie~anne{T§} 19:57:39 pm CST
Jarl, this slut read in the Wall Street Journal approximately 2 years ago, when the books were at their
height, they accounted for a jump in the sale of BDSM...toys...as much as 18%...and this slut suspects that
the movie will cause another upsurge...

Rollo the Ax 19:58:14 pm CST
Okay..... we have a topic now.....

Rollo the Ax 19:58:58 pm CST
Today's Topic

There will be quotes places below and then tell us what you think

of the quotes.

Quotes For This Week

"One does not know, truly, what it is to stand, until one has
fallen. Once one has fallen, then one knows, you see, what it is
to stand." (Beasts of Gor, p.340)

"How can one know the answer to a question which one fears to
ask?" (Explorers of Gor, p.11)

"It is often easier to know others than ourselves. Perhaps that is
because there is less need to tell lies about them. Few of us
recognize the stranger in the shadows, who is ourself." (Magicians
of Gor, p.188)

"Every organism has its place in nature. That of woman is at the
foot of man." (Beasts of Gor, p.429)

"Tears are not unbecoming to the soldier. The soldier is a man of
deep passions, and emotion. Many men cannot even understand his
depths. Do not fear your currents and your powers. In the soldier
are flowers and storms. Each is a part of him, and each is real.
Accept both. Deny neither." (Guardsman of Gor, p.238)

Honor has many voices, and many songs. (Witness of Gor, p.548)

Truth does not care whether it is believed or not; similarly,
stone walls and cliffs do not care whether they are noted or not;
so then let us leave it to the individual to do as he thinks best.
Truth, the stone wall, the cliff, are not enemies; but they are
real. (Witness of Gor, p.586)

"Truth is not terrible; it is merely real." (Blood Brothers of
Gor, p.218)

Questions
1)

Which quote did you like most and why?
What quote do you think translates best in RP?
Do any of the quotes have any dual meanings to you?

Last question, What quote from the books listed or not means the

most to you the player, the person and why?

flicka~ slave of Jarl Keeper. 20:03:45 pm CST
There is much that resonates in most of them, but perhaps for flicka it would be:

"It is often easier to know others than ourselves. Perhaps that is

because there is less need to tell lies about them. Few of us

recognize the stranger in the shadows, who is ourself." (Magicians

of Gor, p.188)

flicka knows she is a victim of self deception.

Rollo the Ax 20:06:40 pm CST
Yes, flicka..... that one rings true for so many... at times we all try to look past or ignore our own
limitations or even flaws but very often others see them much clearer than we do ourselves....

ruby~{Randolph} 20:07:21 pm CST
"One does not know, truly, what it is to stand, until one has

fallen. Once one has fallen, then one knows, you see, what it is

to stand." (Beasts of Gor, p.340)

"How can one know the answer to a question which one fears to

ask?" (Explorers of Gor, p.11)

until You have walked in a Free or slave footsteps..then one can't can judge fully in the right light

SaBom 20:08:16 pm CST
That is just human nature Rollo... Nobody wants to show weakness because they fear it will be
exploited... Nobody wants to be thought of as different because they fear being an outcast

Rollo the Ax 20:08:31 pm CST
They all have very good meanings and show just how human we all are.....

leatha {GS} 20:08:51 pm CST
all are good, but leatha finds the first quote to be substantially resonating to girl.

"One does not know, truly, what it is to stand, until one has

fallen. Once one has fallen, then one knows, you see, what it is

to stand." (Beasts of Gor, p.340)

why? because sometimes one has to fall, to learn and become better.

SaBom 20:10:21 pm CST
~nods at leatha's comment
How do you even know victory if you have never tasted defeat?

leatha {GS} 20:10:54 pm CST
nods in agreement with Master SaBom

Rollo the Ax 20:11:19 pm CST
SaBom, I agree with you about weaknesses....... but some of us almost revel in our * differences * ......
LOL..

SaBom 20:11:21 pm CST
Character is built from rising form the ashes of defeat

maddie~anne{T§} 20:11:36 pm CST
~listens to the thoughts of A/all as she ponders each~

SaBom 20:12:02 pm CST
lol @ Rollo
Some do... but we all search out those we think are similar and try to fit in

leatha {GS} 20:12:15 pm CST
leatha's icy blues light in that acknowledgement. again, nods to Master SaBom

flicka~ slave of Jarl Keeper. 20:12:56 pm CST
Master SaBom, with respect that is not flicka's motivation at all. Always flicka has found she relishes
marching to a different drum, delighting in being in a minority. It was what drew her to Gor in the
first place, so many people said " do not have any truck with those Goreans, They are mad and bad. "

For flicka it is that she doesn't see her faults, and yet the same faults/flaws are to flicka glaringly obvious
in others. ~low chuckle~ however, flicka does have a certain Master Who does see her flaws and tries to
correct them.

SaBom 20:13:59 pm CST
Well nothing covers 100% of the situations ~winks

flicka~ slave of Jarl Keeper. 20:14:41 pm CST
And of course viva la difference!!

Rollo the Ax 20:15:29 pm CST
I must admit that as a very young man, I had a major problem with showing emotion..... as an older
person, I was raised in the shadow of John Wayne and such..... you never saw the Duke cry did you ?? it
was considered weakness for a man to cry in public.....

flicka~ slave of Jarl Keeper. 20:20:29 pm CST
Master Rollo, that stoicism in men was common in Your generation, just as in the WWi and WWii PTSD
was not recognised, men were thrown back into civilian life to "get on with it" The really damanged ones
were said to have a "bit" of shell shock.

ruby~{Randolph} 20:20:36 pm CST
"Every organism has its place in nature. That of woman is at the

foot of man." (Beasts of Gor, p.429)

girl likes this quote...a girls place well defined..bond by the will...her belly under the whip of the Free

Rollo the Ax 20:23:02 pm CST
LOL... flicka, in my war it was called a * Thousand yard stare *... just standing there looking for God
knows what or trying not to see God knows what......

marieve{GS}t 20:23:51 pm CST
Aye, ruby. marieve agrees with this quote. It takes a strong woman to become a slave but the contentment
she gains is worth the effort.

flicka~ slave of Jarl Keeper. 20:25:18 pm CST
~nodding~ aye Master Rollo, Your war was perhaps the worst in modern times, at least the men who
fought in the two WWs came home to acclaim. We should all feel shame for the way we treated those
warriors.

SaBom 20:25:44 pm CST
aye marieve... to give up control you must be very strong indeed

leatha {GS} 20:27:37 pm CST
smiles to all the girls as this quote gets focused on. leatha agrees

SaBom 20:28:08 pm CST
I think we do flicka which is what the difference is with the Iraq/Afghanistan veterans receiving their due
for what is also an unpopular war... we learn from our mistakes sometimes

flicka~ slave of Jarl Keeper. 20:29:58 pm CST
~nodding~ Agree with You Master SaBom, perhaps we are beginning to learn the lessons of History and
therfore not make the same mistakes.

SaBom 20:30:33 pm CST
Not always flicka.... not nearly often enough

marieve{GS}t 20:30:43 pm CST
Thank You, Master SaBom. Becoming a slave is more a journey of self discovery.

Rollo the Ax 20:31:11 pm CST
What was done can not be undone, flicka..... many from my war came home but never knew that they
died overthere... it just took more years..... I feel sorry for the kids now... at least we were separated from
family and the world... these kids now have cell phones and internet so they can talk to home every day....
too much stress on both soldier and family.......

SaBom 20:32:10 pm CST
by the nature of being a slave I would think that true marieve

marieve{GS}t 20:32:33 pm CST
The veterans of war never seem to get the support from the government they fought for. It is appalling
how they are abandoned.

Lita, Physician 20:33:00 pm CST
Rollo I would have thought being able to communicate regularly with friends and family would make it
better for them, not worse.

flicka~ slave of Jarl Keeper. 20:33:29 pm CST
Master Rollo, flicka hears what You are saying, a girl has never been a soldier and so has no conception
of the stress on an emotional level, merely can appreciate it on an intellectual level. It must make them
suffer much more.

ruby~{Randolph} 20:34:01 pm CST
agrees mari
to turn over all will, is not for the faint of heart...to trust without question..is a magical thing ..a Master
has great responsibility to not take advantage or break a girls inner spirit

Rollo the Ax 20:34:24 pm CST
If we * learned * from history, we would not have wars at all. but then again, we are human and it seems
that killing is just too damned easy and faster than working out problems.......

SaBom 20:34:45 pm CST
agree Rollo.... your real life didnt intrude on your job at the moment to distract you from the job

Rollo the Ax 20:37:18 pm CST
Lita, the problem comes when those at home still see * little Rodger * as the same guy, but do not
understand the carnage and horror that the soldier lives with 24/7 .....

marieve{GS}t 20:37:21 pm CST
Agreed ruby. How many have we seen rush into a collar only to be disappointed in the end. When all is
said and done it is their slave heart that must mend, but is forever damaged.

Bretval: Scribe~Warrior~Merchant 20:37:30 pm CST
How can anyone who has not experienced it directly truly understand, Lita?

ruby~{Randolph} 20:39:12 pm CST
mari
too many to count

Lita, Physician 20:40:04 pm CST
True, Bretval. and Rollo

marieve{GS}t 20:40:17 pm CST
All we can do ruby is help them deal and move on.

Rollo the Ax 20:42:42 pm CST
LOL...LOL... please don't misunderstand my position... on the if the world has perfect level, war might be
not necessary...... but in our REAL world, we will be killing each other until the day that we are no longer
human......

Lita, Physician 20:44:46 pm CST
*chuckle* Some days, I think some of us are already no longer human!

Bretval: Scribe~Warrior~Merchant 20:48:27 pm CST
Now if we could figure out what it means to be human we might have an idea how to stop war.......

ruby~{Randolph} 20:49:56 pm CST
Master Bretval
and that is the sixty four million dollar question..nods firmly

Rollo the Ax 20:50:40 pm CST
all that those that serve or have served can ask is a bit of empathy and understanding .... kind of a * judge
not lest you be judged * thing........ but also understand... for myself and tens of thousands of other
soldiers we are /were more than willing to go and serve to keep so many others from needing to go
also..... if the Gods require their/our sacrifice ... so be it...... to shield so many others from what it is to kill
and be killed is what soldiers are for......

OriginalSandman_Builder/ Sr. Captain of GS 20:52:38 pm CST
I make it a point to state my appreciation for service to all of the rt warriors I know

ruby~{Randolph} 20:52:38 pm CST
pleased to see Master Sandman return safely

Bretval: Scribe~Warrior~Merchant 20:57:00 pm CST
I agree that those who served by choice deserve our respect ... but what of those who were given no
choice.... but what of those who chose not to serve? Is it correct that they had to do into hiding because
they felt that war was wrong?

Rollo the Ax 21:00:54 pm CST
LOL...LOL... never fear, folks..... what has been done, is done... nobody gets go backs or do overs.... the
Gods mock us at so many times.... had I been blessed, I would have joined Wodin in Vallhalla as a young
fit warrior......LOL... now I must beg entry as an old crippled man ..... it is enough to almost make one
laugh.....

OriginalSandman_Builder/ Sr. Captain of GS 21:01:30 pm CST
Bretval,, I am of competing minds on that,, one said those had Contentious objector status available,, on
the other hand I was taught at an early age,, to not judge a man unless you have walked a mile in his
moccasins ( shoes)

flicka~ slave of Jarl Keeper. 21:04:22 pm CST
Master Rollo, ah but if all Men joined Woden as Young warriors we would be bereft of the wisdom of old
men.

ruby~{Randolph} 21:04:27 pm CST
exactly Master Sandman

imho..what the topic quote meant

"One does not know, truly, what it is to stand, until one has

fallen. Once one has fallen, then one knows, you see, what it is

to stand." (Beasts of Gor, p.340)

"How can one know the answer to a question which one fears to

ask?" (Explorers of Gor, p.11)

Rollo the Ax 21:06:00 pm CST
Bretval, the laws of men are not always fair or just... but also, membership in any social group can require
certain calls to duty or serve.....

SaBom 21:06:25 pm CST
~nods almost stunned that flicka came up with that gem ~winks

Bretval: Scribe~Warrior~Merchant 21:08:17 pm CST
Available to those who knew they could try to get it... and if I recall correctly you had to offer to serve in
other ways... and we are talking about kids having to make the decion at their 18th bbirthday ... 3 years
before they could legally thave an alcoholic beverage... sorry that argument never flew in My books

flicka~ slave of Jarl Keeper. 21:08:30 pm CST
~chuckling, wondering if Master SaBom is being sarcastic~

SaBom 21:09:25 pm CST
No flicka - it was a gem

flicka~ slave of Jarl Keeper. 21:10:33 pm CST
oooh in that case ~preening a little~ thank You Master.

SaBom 21:11:07 pm CST

preening really

Rollo the Ax 21:11:49 pm CST
flicka, not all earn the rite to enter Vallhalla... it is only the desire of many/most........ the cards are played,
the dice caste.... we can't go back in time, so Rollo must just go with the flow.....

OriginalSandman_Builder/ Sr. Captain of GS 21:11:59 pm CST
fortunately now in this Country Bretval, they get to chose to serve or not serve,, and everyone of our
warriors I have spoken to in the last 10+ years willingly serve

ruby~{Randolph} 21:12:32 pm CST
indeed Master Bretval
One may die for Their Country..however illegal to enjoy a co,d ale..throws up hands, simply unbelievable

OriginalSandman_Builder/ Sr. Captain of GS 21:15:09 pm CST
nodding to the gemstone,, its does seem a dichotomy

Bretval: Scribe~Warrior~Merchant 21:15:39 pm CST
You are correct about that, Captain... returning to the Volunteer military service was the wisest decision
the power that be were ever forced to make

Rollo the Ax 21:16:01 pm CST
Bretval, some counties have better plans ... ALL 18 year olds do some sort of service.... not all military
but still for the counties good...

Bretval: Scribe~Warrior~Merchant 21:20:03 pm CST
I have no problem with the service.. hell... even to earn the right to vote... but not when the only choice i
s military service

OriginalSandman_Builder/ Sr. Captain of GS 21:21:57 pm CST
nodding to Rollo I believe that would be best everywhere

Rollo the Ax 21:22:09 pm CST
Well, Sandman..... I must take my leave now... I will leave the Forum back in your hands.... we should
almost be done by now anyway........ Be well, all.........

marieve{GS}t 21:23:12 pm CST
Thanks for leading Master Rollo ~warm smile~

ruby~{Randolph} 21:23:36 pm CST
Master Bretval
in the USA...during the Vietnam era..again one could die for ones Country...however could not vote

winks Master Sandman
now that's dichotomy

OriginalSandman_Builder/ Sr. Captain of GS 21:23:37 pm CST
thank you Brother Rollo for running forum,, and for your Service

flicka~ slave of Jarl Keeper. 21:23:56 pm CST
Thank You Master Rollo for conducting forum. Was a great topic.

ruby~{Randolph} 21:24:38 pm CST
oh yike

thank You Master Rollo for leading

pretty preening flicka for scibing

flicka~ slave of Jarl Keeper. 21:25:12 pm CST
~chuckling and running her beak along her non existent feathers~

OriginalSandman_Builder/ Sr. Captain of GS 21:25:28 pm CST
lets go ahead and end forum now,, thanks to all of you ,,for attending and for your faithfulness to our
home

leatha {GS} 21:25:50 pm CST
a girl must excuse herself. leatha wishes everyone ever so well.

Bretval: Scribe~Warrior~Merchant 21:26:39 pm CST
Yes, ruby.... if I recall correctly you had to be 19 to vote... please correct Me if I am wrong

flicka~ slave of Jarl Keeper. 21:27:27 pm CST
~hugs figgy as she rushes out of the door, blowing copious kisses to the Masters, and winking salaciously
at her sisters~

marieve{GS}t 21:27:51 pm CST
thank you pretty preening puddling flick for scribing

ruby~{Randolph} 21:28:09 pm CST
Master Bretval...21 to vote in Vietnam era