Friday, September 12, 1997
The interview was taped earlier in the week at
the George V Hotel in Paris, France and was
also broadcast in other countries, such as Germany,
Canada, and Australia. After the
interview, Barbara Walters stated on the show
The View, that she found Michael to be very
charming.
During this interview, Michael seemed more relaxed,
less guarded than he we have seen him to be in
previous interviews. He was animated and expressed
a whole spectrum of emotions in the short span of
just 20-minutes. From the intonation of his voice
to body language and facial expressions, he showed
sadness, fear, disgust, anger, humor, resolve,
embarrassment, seriousness, happiness, love, pure joy, and
delight.
There was another very pleasant surprise - the
use of sound effects to enhance his speech. Using his own
voice box, Michael casually, but effectively,
interjects sounds of things to add emphasis to his narration:
"tch, tch, tch, tch" - automatic camera shutter,
snapping photos in quick succession; "vrrrum, vrrrum"
- sound effect of a motor scooters' racing engines;
or "chi ching" - mimicking a light pull switch.
MJ = Michael Jackson
BW = Barbara Walters
HD = Hugh Downs
Barbara Walters : Up until last week the most
photographed people in the world were Princess
Diana and Michael Jackson. Now only one remains
to talk about what it means to live under that
kind of scrutiny. Since the allegations of child
abuse made against Michael Jackson four years
ago, he has been, if possible, even more pursued.
By the way, we checked with the District
Attorneys in Los Angeles and Santa Barbara and
learned that there is no active case against
Mr. Jackson today.
Michael Jackson himself is notoriously shy about
giving interviews, but on my way home from
covering Princess Diana's funeral, I met with
him in Paris to discuss the paparazzi and his
personal recollections of the Princess.
When it comes to the paparazzi, Michael Jackson
says that he feels a bond with Princess
Diana. The paparazzi have been a part of his
life since he was a small child, the youngest of
the Jackson 5. He has been a superstar for 3
decades. At 39, he continues to sing and dance
all over the world ... and the paparazzi follow
him all over the world. He has been on a
European Tour for the last five months playing
for over 2 million people. The night Princess
Diana died, Michael Jackson canceled his concert,
but his last two concerts were dedicated to
her. He does not pretend that she was a close
friend. She was a fan.
MJ: I met her first at a ... um (clearing his
throat) ... concert ... in London. She was very
kind ... very loving ... very sweet.
BW: What did you two talk about?
MJ: I wrote a song called 'Dirty Diana'. It was
not about Lady Diana. It was about a certain
kind of girls that hang around concerts or clubs
... you know ... they call them groupies.
BW: Groupies
MJ: I've lived with that all my life. These girls
... they do everything with the band ... you
know ... everything you could imagine. So I wrote
a song called 'Dirty Diana'. But I took it out
of the show in honor of her royal highness. She
took me away and she said, "Are you gonna do
'Dirty Diana?" So, I said, "No, I took it out
of the show because of you." She said, "No! I
want you to do it ... do it ... do the song."
BW: So, she had a sense of humor with you.
MJ: Yeah, of course. And she told me she was honored
to meet me and I said, "It's an honor
to meet you."
BW: How did you hear of her death?
MJ: Um ... I woke up (in a very soft, reflective
voice) ... and my doctor gave me the news.
And I fell back down in grief ... and I started
to cry. The pain ... I felt inner pain ... in my
stomach ... and in my chest. (Michael's voice
begins to break slightly). So, I said, "I can't ...
I cannot handle this ... it's too much" ... just
the message ... and the fact that I knew her
personally. Then on top of that one ... I said,
"There's another one ... real soon ... I feel it
coming ... there's another one ... it's another
one coming and I pray it's not me ... please
don't let it be me ... then Mother Theresa came..."
BW: Are you psychic ... is that what you're saying?
MJ: I don't want to say that, but I've done it before.
BW: And you thought it might be you?
MJ: Yes. (Looking down at his clasped hands) I've
been living that kind of life all my life. The
tabloid press ... that kind of press .. Not the
press ... the tabloids ... the paparazzi ... that
type. I've been running for my life like that
... hiding, getting away. You can't go that way
cause they're over there ... well let's go this
way and pretend we're going that way ... and
we'll go that way. Somebody should say, " Hold
on! Stop! This person deserves their privacy.
You are not allowed to go there!" I go around
the world dealing with running and hiding. You can't
... I can't take a walk in the park ... I can't
go to the store ... you can't ... I have to hide
in the room. You feel like you're in prison.
BW: What's been the most intrusive thing? What's the worst?
MJ: They always have been ... they go as far as
to hide things into places. They'll slide a
machine up under the toilet ... tch, tch, tch,
tch (Michael makes a sound effect like clicking a
camera) ... and you go, "Oh, my God!" They've
done that.
BW: When you came into this hotel, you had to
come in ... or you felt you had to come in ...
through the kitchen.
MJ: I've been doing it for years. In many lobbies, I have never seen the front door. Never.
BW: Did you ever try to outrace the paparazzi?
MJ: To outrace them?
BW: Yes
MJ: They follow you. They chase us on their scooters
[makes another sound effect like a racing
engine - vrrrum, vrrrum].
BW: Cutting in front of you?
MJ: Yes. And I have to say to the driver ... I
say, "Slow down." I jump in and I say, "You're
gonna kill us." I say, "Slow down." I've done
that many times. "You're gonna kill us." So, he
jumps out of the car and yells at these people.
BW: You know, there is that argument that you
rely on publicity to sell your albums ... for your
concerts ... that you want it.
MJ: When I approve of something, yes.
BW: But you can't always control the press. You
can't approve of everything. You can't invite
them in again and again and then, at a certain
point, close them out.
MJ: Yes, you can.
BW: Well, how do you do that? What is that line?
MJ: By doing that. This is their time for this
... and this you should not do. You should not say,
"he's an animal ... he's a ..." You should not
say, "he's Jacko." I'm not a "Jacko." I'm
Jackson.
BW: How do you feel when they call you ...
MJ: Yeah ... Wacko Jacko ... where'd that come
from? Some English tabloid. I have a heart
and I have feelings. I feel that when you do
that to me. It's not nice. Don't do it. I'm not a
"wacko."
BW: There are those who would say that you add to the attention.
MJ: No, I don't.
BW: Well, the masks ... the mysterious behavior.
MJ: There's ... no, there's no mysterious behavior.
There's a time ... when I give a concert
... I like to have as many people who want to
come can come and enjoy the show. And there's a
time when you'd like to be in private ... when
you put on your pajamas and go to sleep ... cut
out the light [MJ makes a "chi ching" sound effect,
to mimic a light pull switch] ... and you lay
down ... that's your private space. You go in
the park. I can't go in the park, so, I create my
own park at Neverland ... my own water space
... my movie theater ... my theme park ...
that's all for me to enjoy.
BW: I don't want this to sound insulting. I'm
just gonna be straight with you. But You are
somewhat eccentric to say the least. The way
you dress .. The way you look ... it invites
attention. The whole appearance as you grew up
was ... larger than life ... more extreme. You
don't think that calls the paparazzi to you?
MJ: No (shaking his head) ... no ... maybe I like
to live that way ... I like to dress that way.
I don't want the paparazzi, really. But, if they
come, be kind ... write the right ... kind thing
to write.
BW: Michael, is it the journalist's role ... or the press's role ... to be kind?
MJ: To be kind?
BW: Because the press also sometimes has to look
into things ... be tough. It can't always be
kind.
MJ: (laughing) What you saw ... what happened
to Lady Diana ... you tell me. There should be
some boundaries ... some kinda way. The star
needs some space. Give him a chance to relax. He
has a heart ... he's human.
BW: You cancelled the concert you were about to do when you heard of Diana's death.
MJ: Yes
BW: And when you finally did a concert, you dedicated your concert to her. What did you say?
MJ: In my heart, I was saying, "I love you, Diana.
Shine. And shine on forever ... because you
are the true princess of the people." And in
words, I did not say it ... but I said it for three
minutes in showing a big picture on all the jumbotron
screens ... Sony, big huge screens ... and
her picture was there, shining. And the crowd
went bananas ... (sound effects of the crowd
noises). I played the song 'Smile' and 'Gone
Too Soon.'
BW: Give us some of the lyrics, if you can.
MJ: Shiny and sparkly and splendidly bright ...
here one day ... gone one night ... Gone too
soon.
Commercial break
BW: You have said, "I grew up in a fishbowl. I
will not allow that to happen to my son." Yet,
when your son was born, you sold pictures to
the National Enquirer and to other European
papers, tabloids. Why did you do that?
MJ: Why?
BW: Why?
MJ: Because, there was a race. There were some
illegal pictures out. Illegally, somebody had
taken pictures of a baby ... and millions of
dollars ... said, "here's Michael's son."
BW: And it wasn't, as I recall.
MJ: And it wasn't. So, I took the pictures of
the baby. I said, "they're forcing me to get his
picture." There's helicopters flying above us
... flying over my house ... flying over the hospital
... um ... machines and satellites all over.
Even the hospital said, "Michael, we've had every
kind of celebrity here ... but we've never had
it like this. This is unbelievable." And, so, I
said, "here ... take it." And I gave the money
to charity.
BW: So, rather than ... in a sense, what you are
saying is ... what you did was to get them
off your back.
MJ: Yeah ... and now they want to do it again
... and I don't want ... maybe I don't want to
show him to the world like that. I want him to
have some space ... where he can go to school. I
don't want him to be called "wacko jacko." That's
not nice. They call the father that. That
isn't nice ... right?
BW: You said you don't want your child to be called
"wacko jacko's son." (lowering her eyes,
obviously unhappy at having to repeat the hurtful
appellation) How are you going to prevent it
... so they don't do it to him?
MJ: That's the thing ... that's the idea. Maybe you should come up with a plan to help me.
BW: You're his daddy.
MJ: There you go. They created that. Did they
ever think that I would have a child one day
... that I have a heart? It's hurting my heart.
Why pass it on to him?
BW: Do you like being a father?
MJ: I love it. (No hesitation and a big smile)
BW: Are you very involved with him?
MJ: (laughing) Yes.
BW: Do you want more children?
MJ: Yes (with an embarrassed laugh).
BW: You have been in the spotlight since you were a baby yourself.
MJ: Yes
BW: If your son showed talent ... by the way does he show any talent at nine months?
MJ: Well, I'll tell you this much ... when he's
crying ... to keep him from crying, I have to do
one thing.
BW: What?
MJ: I have to stand in front of him ... and dance.
BW: Really?
MJ: Yes. And he stops crying. His tears turn to
laughter ... and he's happy (with a clap of his
hands), he smiles.
BW: And do you do your moonwalk with him?
MJ: Yeah ... I do all kind of movements (abrupt
movements in imitation of his dances) ...
(laughs) ...
BW: And then he stops crying?
MJ: And then he stops crying.
BW: You must do a lot of dancing.
MJ: (Laughing louder) I do a lot of dancing, yes.
BW: Michael, if this little boy says, "Daddy, I want to go on the stage?"
MJ: (Peels of laughter as his hand slaps his leg)
BW: After what you've been through?
MJ: I would say, "Hold on, now. Hold on. If you
do go that way, expect this ... expect that ...
expect this ... expect that." (Counting on his
fingers)
BW: You'd lay it all out?
MJ: I'd lay it all out. "See you're gonna get
all this (pointing to one of the camera positions)
... and all this (pointing to another camera
position) ... and all this (pointing to a third camera
position.) You ready to do that?" [If he says]
"Yeah, I can't wait." Then I would say, "Go...
and do it better than I did."
BW: But know what you're in for ...
MJ: Know what you're in for.
BW: Our interview was over. We had told no one
it was happening, nor had the Paris hotel. But
when Jackson tried to sneak out through a back
door, there was a huge crowd ... already
waiting.
HD: Barbara, we know now that Diana did not have
adequate protection on that last day. What
kind of protection did Michael Jackson have?
BW: Well, we saw at least four bodyguards ...
and he needed them. And, by the way, I talked
with a female superstar and she told me that
when she goes out, she has four bodyguards, at
least ... and a car in front of her ... and a
car behind.
HD: That's what they need really, isn't it?
BW: Unfortunately, it is.
HD: Now, you told me that he told you why he only wears one glove.
BW: Yes
HD: What's behind that?
BW: Well, he has a sense of humor, as I think
you could see. He said, "Why one glove? Cooler
than two."
