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[03:16] moritheil: hmm
[03:16] moritheil: tell me
[03:16] moritheil: if you could mix any two classes
[03:16] moritheil: what would they be?
[03:17] Gakar: rogue and wizard
[03:17] moritheil: heh
[03:17] Gakar: and thus i would be like unto a god
[03:17] moritheil: I'm guessing you don't like arcane trickster, though
[03:17] Gakar: havent looked at it really
[03:17] moritheil: IMHO it sucks, but your call
[03:17] moritheil: not that it totally sucks
[03:17] Gakar: sec, let me dig it out
[03:18] moritheil: just that they could have made something better
[03:19] Gakar: its not bad, but yes, it could be better
[03:19] Gakar: it could be a spellthief ;)
[03:21] moritheil: hmm
[03:21] moritheil: that class is pure cheese with cheese on top :P
[03:21] Gakar: hehe
[03:21] Gakar: its hardcore if you are fighting a caster
[03:22] moritheil: seriously, take levels in it
[03:22] Gakar: if you arent, its pretty much a weak rogue
[03:22] moritheil: I want to see this
[03:22] Gakar: doesnt fit the character
[03:22] moritheil: true
[03:22] moritheil: hmm
[03:22] moritheil: and we have no rogues
[03:22] moritheil: hmmm
[03:22] Gakar: do you _want_ me to cheese my character?
[03:22] Gakar: cause if so, i can take warshaper and natrue's warrior levels
[03:22] moritheil: I just want to laugh maniacally
[03:22] Gakar: and you will see the god of druids
[03:22] moritheil: is that too much to ask?
[03:25] moritheil: is it?
[03:26] moritheil: what's warshaper, btw?
[03:26] Gakar: i think everyone deserves the chance
[03:26] Gakar: its a prestige class for those that dont want to wild shape so much as become the walking arm of death himself
[03:27] moritheil: ahahahahaha
[03:28] Gakar: in fact, ya know what?
[03:28] moritheil: how does that work?
[03:28] moritheil: give me some numbers :)
[03:28] Gakar: since you want to provide overpowered races and classes, ill just have to flop out the warshaper and see how it works
[03:28] Gakar: sec, let me get the complete warrior out
[03:29] moritheil: you could swap to one of those races, you know. I think I offered the chance to everyone once I said I was done with them.
[03:29] Gakar: nah, im to fond of human
[03:30] Gakar: mmm.. bear warrior
[03:31] Gakar: you just dont mess with a guy that when he rages turns into a dire bear
[03:32] moritheil: raging dire bear = I'll take those limbs, please, thanks.
[03:32] Gakar: giving him +20str +2 dex +8con and a few points of natural armor
[03:32] Gakar: yes indeedy
[03:32] moritheil: raging dire bear = what, you thought our spellcasters were weak? You poor, misguided, feeble warrior . . .
[03:32] Gakar: muhahaha
[03:33] Gakar: especially if you are a rage mage/bear warrior
[03:33] Gakar: ah, here we are. warshaper
[03:33] Gakar: 5 level prestige class
[03:33] Gakar: i will be able to take it as soon as i get wild shape and +4 bab
[03:34] Gakar: level one, they are immune to critsand can grow either 1d6 claws or 1d8 horns at will
[03:34] Gakar: thats the damage, not the number of spines
[03:34] moritheil: immune to crits at level one?
[03:35] Gakar: yes
[03:35] moritheil: wtf
[03:35] Gakar: they rearange their organs
[03:35] moritheil: and you accuse my writeups of being overpowered?
[03:35] moritheil: they are but a fart next to hiroshima
[03:35] moritheil: ok, go on . . .
[03:35] Gakar: at level 2+4 str/con
[03:35] moritheil: . . .
[03:35] Gakar: at level 3 they can gain reach at will
[03:36] moritheil: okay. I assume their arms elongate?
[03:36] Gakar: yes
[03:36] moritheil: that's kind of neat.
[03:36] Gakar: at 4 they get fast healing 2 and can spend a full round + concentration check to heal 10hp
[03:37] moritheil: oooookaaaaayyyy . . .
[03:37] moritheil: I think our group made a grave mistake in getting rangers and barbs
[03:37] moritheil: we should just have these to tank
[03:37] Gakar: at level 5 they choose one of 2 powers: either change form as a move action if it can change shape at will (like doplegangers) or...
[03:38] Gakar: if it uses a spell or wild shape, can change forms infinitely within the duration of the spell/ability
[03:38] Gakar: becoming a different form every round if so desired
[03:38] moritheil: hm
[03:38] moritheil: if they have this class
[03:39] moritheil: why did they bother coming out with the master shaper?
[03:39] Gakar: it gains bab as a cleric, and gets fighter saves
[03:39] moritheil: this class is like 10x better
[03:39] Gakar: then theres nature's warrior
[03:39] Gakar: let me check it, i remember it having some cool stuff
[03:39] moritheil: nature's warrior I remember as being neat
[03:40] Gakar: oh, occult slayer is damn cool vs casters too
[03:40] moritheil: oh, I remember reading that
[03:40] Gakar: get one of those and a spellthief and no mage survives
[03:40] moritheil: there was a slight flaw
[03:40] moritheil: but it was pretty cool
[03:41] Gakar: ah, ok here we go
[03:41] Gakar: first off, every level of natures warrior stacks with druid levels for all abilities but spell casting
[03:42] Gakar: they gain spellcasting levels every even level
[03:42] Gakar: 5 level prc
[03:42] Gakar: and every odd level they choose one of these abilities:
[03:43] moritheil: "Kill everything in sight." :P
[03:44] Gakar: +3dam on natural weapons, DR 3/-, +1 hit on nat weapons and they act as +1 magic weapons, gain total concealment for 1 min/lvl, gain a powerful grapple attack as per a constricter snake... (cont)
[03:44] Gakar: some of these were used for the aspect of nature variant, by the way
[03:45] Gakar: transform into running water to move and in doing so avoid AOOs, gain fast healing 1,or boost fly speed by 30 and arial manuverability by 1 class
[03:46] Gakar: not nearly as nice as the warshaper, but taking one level to get the DR would be worth it
[03:46] Gakar: oh, i missed 2
[03:47] moritheil: what are the prereqs
[03:47] Gakar: gain natural armor +1 per class level perm, or gain a fireshield in fire elemental form
[03:47] moritheil: that would be nice if fireshield wasn't mad nerfed.
[03:48] moritheil: what are the prereqs? :P
[03:48] Gakar: +4bab, 8 ranks know (nature), 2 ranks know (planes), 8 ranks survival, track feat, and wild shape
[03:48] Gakar: and neutral align
[03:48] Gakar: oh, both classes get d10 hp
[03:48] moritheil: haha, BS prereqs :D
[03:48] moritheil: it does eat one feat, but that's about it.
[03:48] Gakar: im definitely taking some warshaper levels
[03:49] Gakar: i wish someone had played a hexblade
[03:49] Gakar: thats another class i really want to check out
[03:50] moritheil: dude, this stuff is wild
[03:50] Gakar: :)
[03:51] moritheil: I at least make a feeble attempt at balancing things :)
[03:51] Gakar: note, warshaper you give up all spellcasting for those levels
[03:51] moritheil: can you honestly say that, oh, Jubilant, is overpowered compared to Nature's Warrior?
[03:52] Gakar: yes, over half the natures warrior powers require you to be wild shaped to work (into specific forms)
[03:52] moritheil: um, but Jubilant barely gives you any powers compared to that
[03:52] moritheil: put another way:
[03:53] Gakar: it gives you powers, as well as spells every level
[03:53] Gakar: and sneak attack
[03:53] moritheil: take equal leveled Jubilant and Nature's Warriors, and who do you think would win in a fight?
[03:53] Gakar: whats the base class of the jubilant?
[03:53] moritheil: or Jubilant and Warshaper
[03:53] moritheil: base class? any, but Jubilant eats three feats as prereqs
[03:54] Gakar: warshaper might win that, depending on spell use
[03:54] moritheil: I don't think there's any contest
[03:54] moritheil: round 1, warshaper closes and pins the Jubilant
[03:54] moritheil: round 2-end, Jubilant gets choked to death
[03:54] moritheil: end of story.
[04:00] moritheil: anyhow, so much for prime-class-to-the-end, eh? :D
[04:00] Gakar: yeah, well, gotta be able to flatten the monk if he gets out of line
[04:00] moritheil: it's pretty sick that you can do that.
[04:01] Gakar: besides, i havent used a prestige class yet
[04:06] moritheil: true
[04:07] moritheil: wahahahaha
[04:08] Gakar: good god
[04:08] Gakar: first level +4ac
[04:08] moritheil: it's twice the brokenness of Jubilant
[04:08] moritheil: and half the justification :D
[04:08] Gakar: sec, reading
[04:09] Gakar: ok, thats just wrong
[04:10] moritheil: hahaha
[04:10] Gakar: it needs _much_ higher prereqs
[04:10] moritheil: even the name
[04:10] moritheil: is like a twelve year old's idea
[04:10] Gakar: can you say munchkin, boys and girls?
[04:10] Gakar: i knew you could
[04:10] moritheil: if someone were to play this
[04:10] moritheil: can you say tiamat, boys and girls?
[04:11] moritheil: ahahaha
[04:11] Gakar: dont show (Name withheld)
[04:11] Gakar: for the love of god and all that is holy, dont show him
[04:11] moritheil: the greatest thing is
[04:11] moritheil: it's so BS
[04:11] moritheil: because there is no explanation
[04:11] moritheil: besides flavor text
[04:11] moritheil: "Just like the dead make no sound, you won't either"
[04:11] moritheil: well, duh, that's cause they aren't moving!
[04:12] moritheil: oh, and the addition of stuff to the spell list
[04:12] moritheil: PLUS gaining a previous class's levels and spells
[04:13] moritheil: that's great
[04:13] moritheil: "Why choose between giving new spells, like assassin, and enabling progression, like mystic theurge? We'll do both!"
[04:15] moritheil: this is also pretty freaky.
[04:16] Gakar: wow, whoever wrote this needs to format better
[04:16] moritheil: yeah
[04:16] moritheil: requirements: d8 hit dice
[04:16] moritheil: awesome
[04:16] moritheil: quality.
[04:17] Gakar: damn, you get a magic item just for taking the class
[04:17] Gakar: and followers
[04:17] moritheil: keep going
[04:17] moritheil: it gets sillier
[04:17] Gakar: what the hell is this "other" column?
[04:18] moritheil: I don't know, but it doesn't matter, there's enough evidence that it's twinky
[04:18] moritheil: have you gotten to the Stopping part?
[04:18] Gakar: yes
[04:18] moritheil: damage and stopping
[04:18] Gakar: yep
[04:18] moritheil: and all you have to do is declare it
[04:18] moritheil: easily 10x better than Touch of Joy
[04:19] moritheil: oh, and keep reading
[04:19] Gakar: i did
[04:19] moritheil: all your healing is quickened free!
[04:19] moritheil: don't bother to stop ginsuing those enemies!
[04:19] Gakar: yep
[04:19] moritheil: just heal AND attack!
[04:21] moritheil: another poorly written and cheap class.
[04:21] Gakar: why does every prestige class on here have sneak attack?
[04:21] moritheil: because they're obsessed with it
[04:22] Gakar: "always sneaky" eh?
[04:22] moritheil: yeah
[04:22] Gakar: cause, as we all know, fire is subtle
[04:22] moritheil: it's totally like
[04:22] moritheil: completely fire themed
[04:22] moritheil: :)
[04:22] moritheil: fire is silent, apparently
[04:23] Gakar: yes, it never "roars" or "crackles"
[04:23] Gakar: ever
[04:23] moritheil: almost reasonable, then there's DR15/magic
[04:24] Gakar: im not even going to read that, for fear of my head exploding
[04:25] moritheil: it's okay, it's okay, and then WHAM, not okay
[04:25] moritheil: there's some SR thrown in too
[04:25] moritheil: the justification for a swanmay having DR15 is that "oh, but they can't do anything in swan form"
[04:25] moritheil: totally forgetting that DRUIDS take this class often (Natural spell)
[04:26] moritheil: The justification for SR is "it's less than what drow get"
[04:26] Gakar: yes, cause swans are so very hard to stab
[04:26] moritheil: and resistant to fireballs, apparently
[04:26] Gakar: so it would seem
[04:26] Gakar: mental note: dont hunt swan or cook it for dinner
[04:26] moritheil: "Given these factors, and the strict requirements for entry, it is felt that the Swanmay prestige class is well-balanced. That said, on with the show!"
[04:27] moritheil: Requirements for entry: Wild Empathy. Knowledge (nature) 14 ranks. Human female. BAB +4.
[04:27] Gakar: oh yeah, real strict
[04:27] moritheil: oh the humanity . . .
[04:29] moritheil: this was stolen, but I don't remember where from.
[04:29] Gakar: drunken master, from sword and fist, and the complete warrior
[04:29] Gakar: probably oriental adventures too
[04:29] moritheil: thanks. I knew I'd read a real version
[04:29] moritheil: I've read oriental advent. so probably there
[04:30] moritheil: this is funny. kensai/ranger/bard/paladin, ya!
[04:30] moritheil: oh, and assassin too.
[04:31] Gakar: you understand that you are causing me pain by showing me these, right?
[04:32] moritheil: OK, I'll stop.
[04:33] moritheil: necroscoundreL! Because it's a necro . . . and a scoundrel!
[04:40] moritheil: I'm tempted to write up an adamantine golem prestige class and send it in
[04:40] moritheil: I'm sure it would be well-recieved there :P
[04:40] Gakar: quite
End of Gakar buffer: Wed Mar 09 04:48:15 2005