This was an interesting discussion from the newsgroup RGMW
Postings by Myrmidon are in black
Postings by slaughterkin are in blue
FIVE steps to painting a BEAUTIFUL ARMY
From:
slaughterkinMyrimdon, no need to send copies to my email, as I read everything posted on the group.
Having read your entire post, let me say that you are clearly a VERY experienced painter-
and in that case you can freely break rules and create beautiful miniatures that others
would not be able to create. In fact, while disputing several of my statements you were
actually laying down even more complex rules. My only intention was to give a guide for
the beginner who is looking to upgrade to a more impressive style.
Experts such as yourself who have studied color and optics obviously don't need my advice.
Do recognize that your advice is a little too advanced for most people to actually be able
to use. While your statements about hot and cold colors, and your comments about mixing
whites are no doubt true and scientifically proven, they don't have much practical
application for "most" painters. Ex.
Ques. what do you highlight blue with?
Ans. [any] Lighter blue.
Ques. How do you get light blue?
Ans. Go buy it or.... mix a bit of the white you already have with the blue you already
have.
Which of the above do you think most painters will do given they have limited funds? (esp
considering they have to do it for every color they have)
While you may prefer one to the other, to most people who haven't had your training the
difference is exceedingly minimal.
As long as you are consistent with your shading it really doesn't matter what shade of
lighter blue you use, it will still come out looking relatively nice. Agreed?
Also, I use strong statements to make strong points. If I said "well maybe, but, you
can kind of, but, then again." all it would do is confuse those I am trying to speak
to. There is always an exception. I know that. Really, I do. If you know the exception you
don't need to hear the advice. But trust me PLENTY of people don't know the exceptions. (I
will refer back to this often.)
Finally beauty is subjective. Duh, Try to understand the purpose of my original post.
Perhaps a more accurate title would have been "5 steps to very likely getting more
compliments about your painting whether or not you actually like it more, but you probably
will." I think my title and statements, will a bit brusque, get the point across much
better.
Overall you make some nice points, but you generalize a lot.
1) PLAN to paint a color scheme. Do not deviate from this scheme!
Planning is EXTREMELY IMPORTANT. However, don't be afraid to deviate from a plan if your planned colors aren't working out. Try a variation of your original set, or a whole new set and repaint the ones that didn't work out the first time. Also, don't be afraid to vary a few in a unit (especially WHFB) where units often were equipped with homemade uniforms that had a good bit of variation. Imperial Guard is another one that comes to mind for variation.
Right, that was what I was saying. If you change the scheme, then don't deviate from
that one.
See my point about making strong statements.
All armies should consist of 3 colors. Secondary colors such as, but not limited to, white grey black bone or any metallic do not count against this, but if prominently displayed should count against the three. Remember: 2 colors is boring, 4 colors is a mess. Don't believe me? Go look at entire armies in pictures and see if it's true.
I have seen plenty of well-painted single color units and armies. If you want a few examples, try the 3rd Ed. Marine Codex on page 23 & 24. The single color "Revilers" (all Bluish Gray) and the "Rampagers" (all Red) are just 2 examples of well-painted and attractive figures that already break your rules.
Do you think most painters other than experts can create a one-color army and have it look good? Remember who this is aimed to.
Exceptions- this is more true in WHFB than in W40K: certain models demand deviation from the set pattern. For instance deamons or Dragons or any unusual creature which obviously would not share the same color patterns as the rest of the army. In this case, set up a new set of 3 colors for it and do not deviate from that for all similar models in the army. This is the case with my Tyranid weaponry. All of my tyranid weaponry has its own set of 3 colors or variations that I must follow, apart from the colors the creatures have.
WARNING-- Avoid metallics. For all the beginners out there, metallics look like CRAP. Use them sparingly, if at all. Metallics are good for highlighting, that's about it. NEVER "paint" anything a metallic color.
Never? Again, a generalization, and not a good one. You would have been much better off with the "Use them sparingly, if at all" as your ending statement. (WHFB) - I've seen some great units of Chaos warriors & Chaos Knights done in mostly metallics with rust and bright detailing. Again, it depends on the subject matter and your treatment of the paint and the detail, not on the paint itself.
You aren't the first person to misunderstand what I said.. So I guess I didn't make
myself clear enough. If you do rust and bright detailing then you aren't
"painting" the metallic. What I am talking about is people who paint a model
silver in the way a beginner would paint an ultramarine Ultramarine Blue. Flat color and
nothing else. Don't do that with metallics. It wont look as good as you hope it will.
Also don't you agree it's quite difficult to paint a model well if the major colors are
all metallics? That's why I recommend that beginners avoid it whenever possible! (Notice I
used the word beginners in the warning)
2) Bright models are Beautiful. Dark models are Ugly. HIGHLIGHT HIGHLIGHT HIGHLIGHT. Highlighting is the most important thing in building a beautiful looking army. Whatever colors you choose to put on your armies, highlight them with even lighter versions. I can't stress this enough. Dot stop at dark blue highlighted with blue, go to light blue and then even lighter blue. Do this for every color on every model.. no exceptions. Mix white into EVERYTHING.
Ugh! Awful advice! Just so you don't think I'm trying to be an ass about this, please understand my background in miniatures and painting. I've been collecting and painting minis since I was 10 and I passed 10 more than 2 decades ago. I also have a Bachelors of Fine Arts degree with a duel major in Drawing and Painting. I got started in Fine Arts due to my love of mini painting - I well over 1000 old Dungeons & Dragons figs by various makers, and that isn't counting the 1000 - 2000 pt Marine, I.G., Chaos, and Tyranid 40K armies I have as well. First a bit about color and paint. The color in paint is reflected light (and yes, this is important, as there's a huge difference in reflected light as opposed to emitted light!) The chroma or intensity of a color is dependent on the type of pigment particles and the density or amount of pigment in the paint medium. The ONLY WAY to increase chroma or brightness in paint (because it is reflected light) is to increase the amount of pigment to medium mixture or to use a brighter pigment. When you add white to a color, you lighten it, but that is NOT the same as brightening it.
I know this. I AM saying lighter.
If you add a small amount of white to a dark blue, you
Will brighter or more intense because of the push pull effect.
Right! but this isn't the point I was making in the statement you disagreed with.
I actually agree with what you are saying its darn good advice, and something I hinted at,
but didn't directly say, which is, use interesting color combinations, also called
"complimentary colors". But you are assuming certain things are happening that I
am not assuming. You of course will use bright (complementary) colors to make models stand
out in appropriate areas. Most inexperienced painters will not do that. They use
repetitive dark colors and then don't highlight in appropriate areas. Essentially your
advice is directed towards people who are already doing all the things that I recommend.
We are speaking to two different groups. When I said mix with whites, I actually meant a
lighter version not a brighter version... As I stated, I feel that models should be
highlighted LIGHT.
Ex. look at a trash bag in a bin. Notice how said trash bag is either jet black or very
dark green. Yet the highlights (parts where light reflect off the plastic) of said bag are
nearly WHITE. This is what made me realize that I needed to do very thin but very light
highlights in order for my models to really stand out. Of course you don't want to do the
entire model like that, you have to select the correct areas.. But you
The most stunning army I've ever seen in battle was painted by a friend of mine who now works for GW. It was a goblin army. Normally tons of goblins are nothing special to look at, but he had boldly highlighted each goblins face, body, weapon and mount. What's more he did it with a variety of bold colors and repeated the highlighting consistently throughout the army. I can now say the best painted army I have ever seen was a goblin army.
Well, that contradicts what you said earlier about "use white with everything" to highlight. I can virtually guarantee that if they were "boldly highlighted" that the painter didn't just add white to the color.
No it's not a contradiction. They were highlighted a white mixture of the previous color. I can virtually guarantee you that we are talking about different things. I am referring to taking, lets say... straight dark angels green and mixing 3-5 parts white, then applying as highlight with nothing in between. That is "bold" to me. You clearly consider "bold" to be something else. Perhaps "stark" is more to your liking. The word is not important. What is important is stressing to painters that highlighting is VERY IMPORTANT. Everything else is just obscuring that fact. Remember the target audience.
ON THE OTHER HAND, dark models, no matter HOW WELL PAINTED under normal light look drab and plain, if not just ugly. YES this means YOU. So highlight! Then highlight AGAIN!!!
Not true of necessity, and not true in fact. There are examples to numerous to list that show the error of this line of reasoning. Look around the web. There are some great "Ugly & Dark" Chaos armies that stand out on the table top, dark or no, because the painter knew the above color and optical theories and used them to full advantage.
See my point about strong statements above. Also see my point about experts and
exceptions.
Do you think the average painter can pull that off?
3) Abstraction is Beautiful. Realism is Ugly
Do not paint every detail on the model!!!!!!!!!
This may seem totally contrary to what one might expect. But it is true. Every color variation you put on a model can be seen at a distance. What seemed like a good idea in painting a belt sack and dagger a variety of colors at 2 inches away, looks like utter CRAP from 4 feet away. All you see are blotches of color because the detail is lost at that distance. Certain models in the GW line are overloaded with detail. Stick to the three main colors, and slight deviation into the neutral colors stated above. (And you should repeat the same neutral colors too)
This started out well and went astray. You could have given a simple example of the "to much detail is bad" idea and made the point better - but the stuff about Abstraction verse realism is utter crap. First of all, all painting (and most 2 dimensional Art) is Abstraction! No matter how realistic a painting I do of an apple, I can't eat the painting and get the nourishment of an apple from it. If I take a photograph of an apple that's visually exact in every detail, I still can't eat it and gain the nourishment of an apple. Bottom line, all art is abstraction - it's not the real thing itself that the art is speaking of, but rather a representation of it or in other words an "abstraction" of the real thing itself. (Sorry if I rant a bit here, but I'm sick to death of hearing twits at college - the so-called educated type - argue about abstraction verse realism. All static visual arts {i.e. drawing, painting, and some sculpture} are dead things! They are ALL ABSTRACTIONS of real things. The only life and emotion they have are those given to them by the viewer.)
Sigh... art students (shaking head) :) I find what you said to be quite interesting,
but that is because I am college educated and philosophically minded.
However your point is wasted in an instruction intended for the casual painter.
Please try to speak in layman's terms, making points useful to said layman.
Just as important.. Don't fall into the trap of painting everything realistically. Realism is ugly. Don't believe me? Look around! When was the last time you were standing in surroundings or clothes that were so beautiful that they should have been in a painting?
I take it you don't get out to Art museums much, or study a lot of art history?
(chuckle) no I don't study art history, and that's why your advice is of so limited use.
Your statement is very appropriate for others who are studying art history, or those who have learned to appreciate the inherent beauty of the colors present in, for example, a painting of a garbage-strewn street corner. However to most people in general, the reaction to said painting will be "why did you paint a
picture of that crap?" This article was about impressing OTHER people, not satisfying ones own particular whims. That's easily done without instruction. So all listeners take note.. If your only desire is to satisfy your own whims, continue doing what you have been doing. But if you desire to catch the eye of passers-by, you might want to try the five steps.sparked the artist's imagination to the point of HAVING to do an image or work, because the idea won't stop bugging the artist. I have a huge collection of art books with literally thousands of still life's of house hold items that the artist captured in such a way as to give you a sense of the person who's objects the artist painted without ever showing you the person. All your statement says is that you personally have never seen something ordinary in an extraordinary way.
No, what it says is that I realize I can't count on the ordinary, no matter how extraordinarily painted, being noticed. The purpose of this was to get your army noticed, remember? :)
> > DO NOT paint every weapon shaft brown and every axehead silver.
This is simply a case of "to much detail is bad" and has NOTHING to do with the amount of "realism" that the painted mini has. Here's a simple example. If I have a page of text, and I highlight a single sentence or paragraph, it stands out. However, if I highlight the entire page - nothing stands out. It all has equal emphasis. This goes right back to the discussion earlier about the brain lending emphasis or importance to objects with more value range and greater color intensity. If you want something to stand out, emphasize a few details, not the entire area. The same is true with minis. If you want them to stand out from their surroundings, give them a greater range of values and brighter colors than your terrain. A good example of the "to much detail"
Actually both statements are closely related. What is the importance of this
argument????
We are both arguing for the same thing in different ways.
I had a mummy unit that was straight grey and white for the wrappings.. but for the axes and maces, I painted the shafts turquoise blue, (with highlight of course) and the metal blades of the axes and balls of the maces were a reddish brown with light bronze highlighting. Also crowns, armor bits or other knick-knacks were also painted reddish brown, but with gold highlights. Came out looking very nice.
Congratulations, you have just broke your own 3 color rule and pointed out that a unit with a lot of variation in value even if it's the same color can look good, and that by conservative use of bright chroma colors for highlights and emphasis (Note - not white highlights) that the unit came out looking good.
huh?
Incorrect. Grey with White highlights, Turquoise Blue, Reddishbrown=3 what is the fourth?
The highlighting obviously doesn't count as another color!!
My friend with the goblins painted all his wooden shafts red. Why? Because red is the complement of green, and it looked good in contrast. Why was the wood red? Who Cares.
Again, while this follows with color theory just fine, it doesn't follow your "mix white with everything" suggestion.
Ummmm he did BOTH. Why does it have to be one or the other?
Basically you make some fine points, but you miss a few as well.
Well thank you. Please realize I am not trying to write a textbook directed to science
majors or professional artists. I'm just trying to help out people who have never had
these statements strongly presented to them.
Also understand I'm competing with a lot of other posts for attention and so try to
present things quickly and to the point.
If you would, Id be interested in what your "[x] fast and easy steps to a better
painted army" would be.
Thanks for the discussion btw, Slaughterkin
