But if you've done all that then okay and good luck with the club
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| Virtual Hogwarts .net > Students clubs > Fellowship of Christian Magic People |
| Posted by: Rachel Ferguson Aug 13 2003, 04:14 PM |
| I noticed there were no Christian clubs... This club would be for anyone who wants to chat about God, share a favorite verse, talk to other believers, get through a hard time, or anything else that's on your mind that you need some help with. If anyone is interested, please post your name house and year!! I'd love to see if this catches on! |
| Posted by: Damaris Damon Aug 13 2003, 04:51 PM |
| Just saying that you need a professors okay before you start club. Also you have to put the name of the club and it's perpose in the club rosters. But if you've done all that then okay and good luck with the club |
| Posted by: Rachel Ferguson Aug 13 2003, 06:03 PM |
| Rachel approached the sign she had pinned earlier that day and wrote under it: Sorry, but ah! I acted like a first year and started this club without asking! I'm working on it now.....I'll post soon if it get's approved! She blushed slightly and hurried off down the hall. |
| Posted by: Kai Porter Aug 13 2003, 06:07 PM |
| I think it's a great idea! (see Rach, I found it after all) It had better get approval, it already has two members! Right, Rach? Kai |
| Posted by: Rachel Ferguson Aug 13 2003, 08:55 PM |
| Rachel giggled when she noticed someone had signed up for the club. Kai had found it after all! "I sure hope the Professor's come back soon..." she nervously bit her thumbnail. |
| Posted by: Noeline Bates Aug 14 2003, 02:52 AM |
| I'm in! This is a great idea. *Crosses fingers* Hope it's approved |
| Posted by: Adrianna Lupin Aug 14 2003, 02:56 AM |
| Sounds like an idea...I don't really go to church on a regular basis in RL, but I still believe in God and everything...I'd be willing to join. |
| Posted by: Professor Faith Tiernay Aug 14 2003, 02:57 AM |
| If it has not already been approved by another professor, I approve this club. |
| Posted by: Adrianna Lupin Aug 14 2003, 03:00 AM |
| Yayness!! ::huggles Faith:: |
| Posted by: Apollo Phoebus Aug 14 2003, 10:43 AM |
| Apollo Phoebus Gryffindor Now I am a Second Year I would love to be in this club! I have a few questions to ask you guys to? So I was wondering have you guys ever had a vision. And I am being totally serious! |
| Posted by: Rachel Ferguson Aug 14 2003, 04:49 PM |
| Rachel *beams* in happiness and hugs the professor. "OH, Thank you thank you thank you!!" She rips down the new sign and re-posts the other one. She turns around, ecstatic to see people interested. "Okay, first things first, this won't be a really strict club, and meetings can be anytime you like. Just post your feelings here, and the other people can give you their input! Thanks so much for your interest!" Um..what do you mean vision Apollo? |
| Posted by: Chia Baturi Aug 14 2003, 05:01 PM |
| I guess this club isn't for me, I'm Jewish. |
| Posted by: Rachel Ferguson Aug 14 2003, 05:10 PM |
| Rachel bites her lip, not wanting to shoo anyone away, but not of course able to ignore Jesus Christ either. "Well...maybe you could start your own Jewish club?" she said, looking hopefully. "Then, maybe, we could go to the Hospital wing and talk to, or pray for, patients there of both religions." She smiled at the other girl, hoping her idea wasn't too rash. |
| Posted by: Apollo Phoebus Aug 14 2003, 07:32 PM |
| "Well I mean have you ever had a vision from God about you or someone you know in the future?" "And shouldn't the club be for anyone who is religous and we just wont get mad at anybody who does not agree with us. And we should just listen to them and respect what they believe in." |
| Posted by: GregorSamsa Aug 14 2003, 08:08 PM |
| If this is the first religious club, why don't you have it include all religions and not just Christianity? We don't need separate religious clubs (I actually think we don't need any), and all religions have basically the same idea as far as spirituality and morality goes. Edit: whoops, Apollo said the exact same thing. Sorry, mate. |
| Posted by: Rachel Ferguson Aug 14 2003, 08:38 PM |
| Rachel bit her thumbnail, unsure about what to say. "I disagree that all religions have the same idea, but combining the clubs would probably be alright I suppose...what I would worry about is people arguing with each other about beliefs, or whats "right and wrong"...I didn't want this to cause conflicts...it was supposed to promote bonding..." She glanced at Gregor. "I'm sorry you feel that way about religious clubs...I just thought maybe it would be a good way to meet some new friends...." The great feeling she had when the club began has lessened considerably. She hoped no one was angry... |
| Posted by: GregorSamsa Aug 14 2003, 09:02 PM |
| Don't worry, Rachel; your club is fine. I thought there would be more conflict if you tried dividing it up and making people feel left out. I disagreed with the existence of religious clubs just because of the fighting it inevitably causes, though sometimes fights between Christians of different denominations can be the most vicious. Anyway, I say religions are the same basically because most of them the promote goodwill, morality, devotion, spirituality, etc. What you want believe beyond that is up to you and doesn’t change the kind of person you are. |
| Posted by: Professor Faith Tiernay Aug 14 2003, 11:42 PM |
| Okay... Just thought I'd post... Both of you (Gregor and Rachel) have very good points. People with religious differences usually get along (forget for one moment that I'm a firm believer that every war was started by religious conflict), except for when belief becomes a huge thing... Here's what I think: Why not make it a religious club, but with different sections? As in, there's a group of Jewish people, Christians, Wiccans, Buddhists, Muslims, whatever. You can each do your own seperate thang and meet friends of the same beliefs in your groups, but you can regularly have inter-religion meetings and bond with those who have stripes of a different colour!  Just an idea... I hope in this club, everyone can act maturely and not create fights and arguments. If that does happen, I won't even have a second thought about closing this.  So behave. |
| Posted by: Rachel Ferguson Aug 15 2003, 12:13 AM |
| Rachel nods at the professor's words. "I think thats a great idea. How do you think we should do it though, all in this topic or different ones?" |
| Posted by: Professor Faith Tiernay Aug 15 2003, 01:34 AM |
| Probably just one, to conserve our poor widdle forums from clutter. |
| Posted by: Rachel Ferguson Aug 15 2003, 01:42 AM |
"Alright, well it sounds good to me. I guess we'll just wait and see who posts? And to make it a little easier, state what religion your posting about, to avoid confusion!"  |
| Posted by: Apollo Phoebus Aug 15 2003, 05:33 AM |
| Well I am posting under Christianity! "So I would still like to know if anyone has ever had a vision or a dream that came true?" "Thank you for helping out with the problems Professor."  |
| Posted by: Selene_Pendragon Aug 15 2003, 03:49 PM |
| Selene Pendragon Gryffindor Well hi now everyone! I'm kinda of a wiccan/chatholic. But Now I'm just a full time Catholic! My buddy Apollo told me about this. So naturally, i had to join! |
| Posted by: Rachel Ferguson Aug 15 2003, 04:06 PM |
| Rachel looked at Apollo, rubbing her chin. "I'm sorry..I can't say I have ever heard of a vision like that. But, it could have been real I suppose, God blesses all of us differently." She shrugged her shoulders, and patted Apollo on the shoulder. "How do you know it was from Him?" |
| Posted by: LoganPendragon Aug 15 2003, 07:14 PM |
| hi im sorta a pagan(well not yet anyways)\cathlic Can i join? |
| Posted by: Rachel Ferguson Aug 15 2003, 07:52 PM |
| Rachel nodded to the person. "Oh, sure, anyone can join. I was just wondering, you can't really be both pagan (or wiccan) and catholic can you?" She shrugged her shoulders, terribly confused. This club wa not going at all the way she had intended, but, I suppose at least no one was fighting.... |
| Posted by: Skye Phoenix Aug 15 2003, 07:53 PM |
| What about agnosticism? I know it's not really a religion so much as its a frame of mind about the entire idea of a supreme being.. but does that count for this club? ((ooc: I may be mistaken, but as I've been taught, witchcraft goes against christianity... so how could anyone who's a witch or wizard really be a christian?)) |
| Posted by: Rachel Ferguson Aug 15 2003, 07:59 PM |
| "Agnosticism...isn't that like if someone doesn't really care if theres a God or not...like it doesn't matter either way to them?" Oh, and about witchcraft....yes that's very very true...it does say in the Bible that witchcraft is sinful and should not be practiced---most Christians I know don't even read Harry Potter or any fantasy for that reason. Personally, I think that as long as its believed that its all fake---just imagination at work, there's no harm in it. I haven't yet figured out about Rachel though---if she is a student then yes I guess that could be a problem, since she would naturally practice magic....*sigh* I just don't know. Maybe this club should be just ooc? .....Very good point Skye. I wish I had a better answer. |
| Posted by: LoganPendragon Aug 15 2003, 08:57 PM |
| i ment that i am catholic converting to a pgonist and because the bible is agenst fantisy this is why... |
| Posted by: LoganPendragon Aug 15 2003, 08:59 PM |
| i ment that i am catholic converting to a pgonist and because the bible is agenst fantisy this is why... |
| Posted by: LoganPendragon Aug 15 2003, 09:02 PM |
oh and isnt the bible agenst homosexuality, if so i cant join this club so.... sorry for bothering you!  |
| Posted by: Apollo Phoebus Aug 15 2003, 09:11 PM |
| "Yes the Bible says that if you commit an act of homosextuality that that is a sin. But if you a homosexal then that is alright you just cant act on it." "And yes in the book of Revolation it says and I quote 'Outside are the dogs, those who practice magic arts, the sexually immoral, the murderers, the idolaters and everyone who loves and practices falsehood.' Before that they were talking about the great city of God and how it is perfect and if you are any of those things above then you will suffer the rest of your life." "Rachel I agree that witchcraft is bad, but the truth is that it really does exsits. Satan uses it to fool people. It is like his miracles." "I love this club. I think it is very productive." "Oh and thanks for coming Selene!" |
| Posted by: LoganPendragon Aug 15 2003, 09:51 PM |
| witchcraft is not created by saten satenest is created by saten! oh and if i cant do anything homosexual im definitly converting not no mention that i already did do somthing homosexual well um... yea now you think im a ###### dont you? (ooc sorry about useing the word ###### i couldnt find any other word for it) |
| Posted by: LoganPendragon Aug 15 2003, 10:06 PM |
| i just relized that in RL im mudblood\muggle-born |
| Posted by: Rachel Ferguson Aug 15 2003, 11:37 PM |
| Ok, I have given up. The inevitable has happened, and the fighting has begun. I HATE HATE HATE it when people argue, yell, and especially cuss just because of different view. Please, if you cannot find another way to express different opinions, no longer post in this club. I don't want to disclude anyone, but the main goal of this club was, up to this point, to promote unity and to discover a little more about ourselves and those around us. Since this proves impossible because of strong opinions, it saddens me to say that I dont know how this can go on any longer. My greatest wish is that everyone can see past the differences and respect everyones beliefs that they are rightfully entitled to have. Please, Please, PLEASE stop the madness!!! I truly care for everyone, even those who do not share my beliefs. I want to get to know you all, and you all to know each other. Maybe if we can all just hold our tongues, it can be a great experience. Thanks for wishing to join, and please consider my plea. ---a saddened Rachel Ferguson |
| Posted by: Audrey Emerson Aug 16 2003, 12:05 AM |
| okay guys, hi. As a RL Christian I have to admit I have a problem with a religion club in the way that it is now going on. I think this club should just remain as a Christian club, not excluding anyone but at the same time not tolerating anti-Christian beliefs. If some one wants to start another group where world religions are discussed I think that would be great, but it should be a seperate forum. As a Christian, I have a lot of friends who are blatantly against HP and magic in any form and personally, I would like to talk to others that share that problem and see how they deal. It is an important part of Christianity to fellowship with other believers and I think we should have a place at VH where we can do that or talk to people about what it means to be a Christian and have a seperate spot to discuss the differences between Buddism and Wicca... or whatever. ~~Audrey |
| Posted by: Skye Phoenix Aug 16 2003, 12:14 AM |
| Rachel, agnosticsm is basically being unsure about whether there is a God or not. There are four different typoes of gnostics a well; Agnostic Theists: believe that a deity probably exists. ; Agnostic Atheists: believe that it is very improbable that a deity exists. ; Empirical Agnostics: believe that God may exist, but that little or nothing can be known about him/her/it/them. ; Agnostic Humanists: undecided about the existence of God. Further, they do not really consider the question to be particularly important. They have derived their moral and behavioral codes from secular considerations. Their ethical behavior would not be altered if a deity were proven to exist. And also, about what you said in your last post... no one was arguing. |
| Posted by: Hagrid Aug 16 2003, 01:12 AM |
| For the record, I am a Humanist/Existentialist with Nihilistic tendencies. That being said, I'm sort of split on this club. On the one hand, I see no real harm in having it as long as everyone is able to get along with one another. I probably wouldn't have approved it had I been approached, but Faith has and that's fine. My main problem is that it is far to out of character. People here should be roleplaying about being in a club, not discussing real life. Real life belongs on the off topic board, and I think that a thread such as this one could thrive there. But this one is more than welcome to stay if you make a consistent effort to keep things in character. -Hagrid (Who feels that he should have signed this post Butch, as he was so far out of character) |
| Posted by: Selene_Pendragon Aug 16 2003, 01:36 AM |
| Ok, You really shouldn't convert from christianity to paganism, Logan. Take from big sis, it's just not worth it. Paganism is just so confusing! And Apollo I'm so saddened on why you said that wiccan was originated from satan! You know it wasn't and knowing you in RL, you seem pretty hipocritical right now! I didn't do magic as you see it...well actually i can't say that. But i have experienced pretty extraordinary things and they were all during retreats and church! Saying that God and christians have no relationship with magick is just completely wrong. The reason why the church forbids it is because the wiccan beliefs follows a different god. Oh Geez this is really hard to explain. See how confusing it gets? Don't try to figure out things like this! It's not meant to be answered! And I just don't understand why people don't read the HP books because they think it cprrupts our minds or something! THe church says that it's actually a good book to read and that they don't disapprove of it at all! they say it teaches and shows us friendship and courage and all that good stuff for life! (I heard all this from our old youth minister) And Hagrid, there are clubs like SIN that are for RL. But they aren't banned. Oh Gosh please don't close it because I'm in it and i love it, but some clubs are for RL. You know what I'm saying? (Geez if i don't make sense, well it's because i really can't think right now because i just got back from another tiring day at school!) |
| Posted by: Apollo Phoebus Aug 16 2003, 02:17 AM |
| "OK where to start?" "Well Selene you know me better than anyone else! I know that magic is real and that I know that Wicca wasnt created by satan. I am just saying that nowadays Satan uses it to control people. It says in the Bible that magic is not good. I know that God has his own magic. It is called miracles. I have seen things and felt things on retreats and in church too. You know that. I am just quoting the Bible. OK. I just believe that magic should be treaded litghly upon. Also I agree that the HP books are not bad. They do encourage friendship and other good things. And my uncle and aunt do not allow their kids to read HP for the magic reason. PersonallyI think that is soooo stupid but that is just me." "Rachel dont worry I love this club and it is soo helpful to me and others. I know it. " "Hagrid let me just say that this club could only be about RL but I dont think that you should close it down." "Audrey is right this club is important for people to be in so they can talk to others who believe in what they believe." "And lastly Logan, I never said that you are a bad person, I am just telling you what the Curch thinks of those things." "People just misunderstood what i said to be totally negative." |
| Posted by: Rachel Ferguson Aug 16 2003, 02:31 AM |
| (ooc: to go along with Hagrid's wishes I'll roleplay in this club, even though I'm still undecided about how it fits) Rachel looked around at this highly opinionated (not a bad thing necessarily) group. *BIG sigh* "Alright, here's what we're gonna do. Everyone has separate beliefs. They are going to be different. You may read something that is so deeply against what you think it makes you angry, but for the sake of the continuance of this club please disregard it." Rachel stopped, and took a deep breath. "To do this, I ask anyone who wishes to post to, at the top, post what religion you are discussing. Please do not make negative comments about other people's thoughts, and if you can't not than just skip right over their post altogether. I would absolutely love it if everyone could have a place to talk about what's going on, and if we could just smile and skid right along we'd be soooo much happier right? I really hope I haven't stepped on anyone's toes...but thank you for your thoughts and input, I have taken them all into consideration." Her eyes teared up again and she rubbed them away. "Please though, no more open lashing out and hate towards the other posters ok? That doesn't make anyone feel better, no matter what religion." She smiled weakly, saying a silent prayer that all would smoothe out and everyone would at least pretend to get along. |
| Posted by: Rachel Ferguson Aug 16 2003, 03:13 AM | ||
| *EXAMPLE POST* (okay, here's what I had in mind) Posting under Christianity It's been a really discouraging day, but I found a verse that seems to convey how I'm feeling:
|
| Posted by: Selene_Pendragon Aug 16 2003, 06:18 AM |
Look Rachel, i don't think any one is argueing. It's just a discussion about our beliefs. I'm sorry if I posted like I was on a rampage!  |
| Posted by: Apollo Phoebus Aug 16 2003, 09:16 AM |
| Christianity "Yeah Rachel dont worry it will be all right" "Trust in God and everything will end up right." "OK so we need to just put the stuff in the past. WEll I know this will turn out good." |
| Posted by: LoganPendragon Aug 16 2003, 09:48 AM |
| "lets pray!" logan says and starts "our father who artin heaven holo be thy name thy kingdom come thy will be don on earth as it is in heavon give us this day our daily bread and forgive us our trespasses and deliver us from evil amen" |
| Posted by: Rachel Ferguson Aug 16 2003, 03:52 PM |
| *much happier* |
| Posted by: Kai Porter Aug 16 2003, 10:14 PM |
Ok, sorry, I was on a RL trip and was unable to access the internet since my last post. Fill me in guys! Did I miss something big? or are we just chatting pointlessly?  |
| Posted by: Rachel Ferguson Aug 16 2003, 11:19 PM |
| "Well, we hit a few bumps in the road to clubness (hahah does that even make sense) but I think it's going a whole lot better now. You might want to go ahead and read the previous posts." |
| Posted by: Kai Porter Aug 16 2003, 11:47 PM |
| Kai grinns, "nothing life-threatening then? That's good. What would it say about what we stand for if one of our members jinxed another?" (OOC I know that I can trust the people in this club. I want to ask you to pray for my family...especially my Grandfather, who is recovering from cancer, and my aunt. I can't specify the problem with my aunt, but it is wearing down my Grandma and my Grandpa. Thanks.) |
| Posted by: Selene_Pendragon Aug 16 2003, 11:56 PM |
| ((Your family is in my prayers, Kai! i really hope they get better soon!)) |
| Posted by: Kai Porter Aug 17 2003, 12:27 AM |
((thanks Selene. I really apreaciate it! God has a plan, so I'm sure that what's happening to my aunt is happening for a reason. It's just kind of hard to deal with sometimes. )) |
| Posted by: Rachel Ferguson Aug 17 2003, 01:26 AM |
| Oh my, I'm so sorry. I will definately keep her in my prayers as well. |
| Posted by: Jinx Aug 17 2003, 04:37 AM |
| Jinx White Eagle Christian [COLOR=purple]Jinx quietly enters the room. Listening to the dialog of the others and enjoying the lively conversation. "Apollo, I wanted to answer your question about a vision. Yes, I have had a vision. Sometimes, I think others have them and discount them as dreams. Kai, I will add your family to my prayer list. I think this club is a good idea. I might not get on much as the homework and quidditch games take up a lot of time. When the bible talks about magic, I have always thought it meant black magic. Or, relates to the people that use magic to trick people out of their money. Promising they would be healed if they bought their product. I too, have family that forbids any Harry Potter stuff. One of the strictest families has read the books now and think they are great. One of the others won't read them. I have suggested they should not discount the books until they have read them." |
| Posted by: Rachel Ferguson Aug 18 2003, 12:16 AM | ||
| Rachel smiles at the happily chattering club members, and is very glad to meet a prefect. Hungry, she quickly scribbles down a note:
and stuck it on the club poster board. With a quick glance, and a pang of nostalgia at the mini-movement she almost began, Rachel exited the club meeting room. |
| Posted by: Selene_Pendragon Aug 18 2003, 04:12 AM |
| Kai, You know of course that God has a reason for everything. It hurts though when something like this happens. But God doesn't intentionally try to hurt us! All you can do is trust him! |
| Posted by: Kai Porter Aug 18 2003, 09:59 PM |
| Maybe not to hurt us, but to teach us. I've been thinking, and the situation with my aunt has made me wonder if God wants me to help people with disabilities. I know the pain they and their families go through, and if I knew anyway I could help I would. |
| Posted by: Selene_Pendragon Aug 19 2003, 01:24 AM |
| One day you'll know for sure! Just don't get frustrated and don't loose faith! |
| Posted by: Rachel Ferguson Aug 19 2003, 02:17 AM |
| That's a very admirable goal, Kai. I think it would be very inspiring to work with the disabled, and goodness knows there's a need for it nowadays. |
| Posted by: Apollo Phoebus Aug 19 2003, 06:29 AM | ||
| "Jeeze being gone a weekend kills ya!" "Well Kai, I will keep your aunt in my prayers. And you and Selene are right there is always a reason for things." "And Lord knows that I know what that is like to not know that God wants you to do something, but not know what it is. Selene should know what I mean. She helped me through it." "Also Jink, well I think that when others have visions it is hard to accpet becasue we ant to feel special. I have had a vision or two and when others tell me about their's I just have to take their word for it. I also have had a lot of dreams that are very significant in my life." "And I think the Bible means all magic, but I could be worng. I know that there is "white magic" and I believe that those who do "white magic" will be able to repent but those who use "black magic" will be less likey to repent. That is just my opinion. Also remeber God will forgive anyone who asks for forgiveness."
|
| Posted by: Rachel Ferguson Aug 20 2003, 12:50 AM | ||
VOTD (verse of the day)
This one was particularly prominent today since I started back at school---*shudders* It's really hard starting new classes...not knoing anyone....ah well. |
| Posted by: Jinx Aug 20 2003, 02:49 AM |
| I just listen to a new song out by Clay Walker. About not questioning God about his decisions but wondering why. Why do some die young. Why can some couples not have children when there are some babies born to couple that don't care. Just made me think of all the times I have said that when I get to heaven I have a million questions. My vision was more of an out of body experience when I had surgery once. I went away and was going to the LIGHT. I was sent back when a wonderful voice told me it was not yet my time. I woke with panicky nurses and had such regret that I had been sent back. Since then I have no fear of dying, only of the saddnest my family would feel by missing me. It is hard to explain to others the peace that our faith in Jesus gives us. |
| Posted by: Selene_Pendragon Aug 20 2003, 06:02 AM |
| I had a out of body experience too Jinx! I got into a bike accident and was knock out and laying on the road for about 15 minutes. I saw this light and it was like someone was talking to me! They told me that I was burning and I told them that i knew but didn't care. They said that now was not the time for me to go and that there is someone out there that will miss me. The miss me part is another story.....Next thing I know, I'm in an ambulance and i go hysterical and in a panic. ever since then, I've tried to make my faith in God much more stronger because you really have no idea when your time will come for you to die. I was way off from dying but something like this never happens to me and it just opened my eyes a little. |
| Posted by: Kai Porter Aug 20 2003, 10:59 PM |
| Whoah. That's freaky, selene. I was gifted enough to save a kitten this afternoon. Some heartless freak dumped a litter out side my middle school. He's helping me type now, so I'm having a little trouble His name is Tuna. (he ate like a whole can of it in almost notime!)" Kai pets the kitten fondly. |
| Posted by: Selene_Pendragon Aug 21 2003, 01:50 AM |
| Aww! A kitten! So you're keeping it? That's great. I can't beleive that some people have a heart to dump little animals like that! It's embarrasing to say that they are human! |
| Posted by: Jinx Aug 21 2003, 02:36 AM |
| It was really an incredible experience. I have been reading a short book on the prayer of JABEZ. Now Jabez was more honorable than his brothers, and his mother called his name Jabez, saying, "Because I bore him in pain." and Jabez called on the God of Israel saying, "Oh that YOU would bless me indeed, and enlarge my territory, that Your hand would be with me, and that You would keep me from evil, that I may not cause pain" So God granted him what he requested. (1Chronicles 4:9-10) Christians that have been saying this prayer everyday have said they have been very blessed. I am going to try it. I have to finish the book but it is only about 20 pages. The Prayer of Jabez by Dr. Bruce H. wilkinson I will write more when I figure out more. I would love to have a kitten. You are lucky. |
| Posted by: Rachel Ferguson Aug 21 2003, 03:57 AM |
| My parents studied that book a little while ago in their sunday school class and really liked it also! Aw, and hello to Tuna! This song has been running through my head lately--- I found a place where I can go I found a place that's holy I found a place where You are No longer looking for me And You'll find me At Your feet And You'll find me kneeling And You'll find me near or far You will find me where You are We sing it in our youth group a lot and I really like it! |
| Posted by: Kai Porter Aug 21 2003, 10:55 PM |
| Christianity Tuna says hi back! he's really happy now. Have any of you heard the song "Ilene" or "Revolution" they're on the dove awards 2003 cd. I listened to them all night. *yawn* Hey, my friend Ayumi has a prayer request. Her assistant Rabbi (she's mesianic jewish) was kicked off because of a misunderstanding. She wants us to pray for him in the hopes it will be sorted out or...the assitant will start a new synigog. they're all praying very hard too. |
| Posted by: Selene_Pendragon Aug 22 2003, 03:36 PM |
| ok they're in my prayers as well! Oh and can you guys pray for me because I have a test in all my classes today...<sigh> it's going to be stressful... |
| Posted by: Rachel Ferguson Aug 23 2003, 12:15 AM |
| Yes, of course Selene! *crosses fingers* good luck!! |
| Posted by: Apollo Phoebus Aug 23 2003, 02:04 AM |
| "Good Luck Selene. Oh and I never said hi to Tuna! 'Hi Tuna.' I will keep the assistant Rabbi in my prayers." "I would like to ask for you guys to keep my family in your prayers becasue my parents are getting a divorce." "And Jink I have had a vision of the future. It involves my family and it was very wonderful. I can't wait for it to come true. I go to a Catholic schooland my religion teacher is so wrong on half of the stuff he talks about and I hope he soenst go to hell for teaching us the wrong stuff." |
| Posted by: Selene_Pendragon Aug 23 2003, 06:27 AM |
| "I PASSED MY TESTS!!! WHEEE!! But I also got three lunch detentions in the process...whoops! I prayed so I can pass the tests before I took them...and lo and behold-I passed!" ((you really have no idea how happy I am becuase I seriously thought I was going to fail them because I do NOT understand this stuff!)) |
| Posted by: Kai Porter Aug 23 2003, 02:50 PM |
| Congratulations!" Kai shakes Selene's hand, "What subject?" |
| Posted by: Rachel Ferguson Aug 23 2003, 04:30 PM |
| Rachel smiled and hugged Selene. "Congratulations!" She looked over at Apollo. "Apollo, I'm so sorry about you parents. I'll definatley pray for you." |
| Posted by: Selene_Pendragon Aug 23 2003, 05:48 PM |
| Selene jumps up and down. "Well, my first two tests were vocabulary and algebra...but those were really really easy. And my last test was Banking and that is the most hardest class I've ever been in! But I passed with a C! Yipee!" |
| Posted by: Apollo Phoebus Aug 24 2003, 09:05 PM |
| "Cool! I am happy for you Selene." "Thanks Rachel!" "You know I dont understand why people have to hate other people for no reason." "I feel bad because I dont know what I did and they wont talk to me about it and then I feel like a bad person and I dont know what I even did. Oh well I guess taht is life." "Well see you all later." |
| Posted by: Rachel Ferguson Aug 25 2003, 12:01 AM | ||
| Rachel's heart went out to Apollo; one of her friends parents had recently gotten a divorce and she knew it was an extremely frustrating time for all involved. "Bye, Apollo. Good luck! Keep praying, I'm sure God has something in store for you!" Not really a VOTD but a "note of the day"... I read this on someone's binder:
|
| Posted by: Apollo Phoebus Aug 26 2003, 02:50 AM |
| "Thanks Rachel. I agree all of my friends are probably sick of hearing me talking about it. I am so glad that it will be over with in September." "Anyways I go to a Catholic school and my Religion teacher is a priest. He is sooo bad. He teaches us all of the wrong things and I am like no you are wrong. And when I ask him a question about something that he is wrong on he is like no it is the way I said it. Ok so he doesnt say that but he basically does because he doesnt even consider my point of view. It makes me really mad." "So I have to pray for him that he doesnt go to hell for teaching us kids the worng things." "Well byebye all." "P.S. I would love to hear what you think about my situation." |
| Posted by: Jinx Aug 26 2003, 03:08 AM |
| I was also in a position where I didn't feel I was given accurate information. Every religion tells us that their interpretation of the bible is the right one. It seems like when you translate something from another language and the words don't fit quite right that interpretations could be wrong. I listened to the bible tapes and had many questions. It seems like you are saved by faith alone. Because you have such faith, you do good works. The hard part is that none of us is perfect. Not even the ones teaching us. They are teaching us what they believe is right. I added you all to my prayer list. Right now I still have more questions than answers. |
| Posted by: Apollo Phoebus Aug 26 2003, 03:24 AM |
| "THanks Jix. I guess you are right. But I mean he is a priest people look up to him. Everyone except me." "Jinx if you would like to ask me some questions you can I mean I do have a very stong relationship with God. So you can try and ask me questions to see if I know the answer." "i am happy to help." |
| Posted by: Kai Porter Aug 26 2003, 11:41 PM |
| Yeah, Jinx. Questions are good. They show that we acknowledge God, and want to grow closer to him. I will answer what I can, but I am very new to the faith (from this view anyway. Got saved over the summer, been going to church my whole life) |
| Posted by: Rachel Ferguson Aug 27 2003, 12:10 AM | ||
Yes to everyone!! That's what this club is all about!!!!
|
| Posted by: Selene_Pendragon Aug 27 2003, 01:11 AM |
| But some questions are left for ourselves to answer. I don't know what kind of questions you have Jinx, but some questions about faith are left for you to try to figure out. Some questions don't have a right or wrong answer and some answers are our own little theories. I heard a story about a man seeing child Jesus at the beach. He was digging a hole and then he took his bucket, filled it with the ocean water and dumped it in the little hole. This man just watched as Jesus filled the bucket, and sumped the water in his hole. Finally he walked up to Jesus and asked why he was putting water in this hole. Jesus says, "I'm trying to get the ocean into this hole. The man says "But it's impossible." And our Lord says, "It is more possible to fill this hole with the ocean then for you to understand the mysteries of God." This story was told to me by one of the core members of my Life Teen. The man watching Jesus was some guy that was trying to understand God. |
| Posted by: Apollo Phoebus Aug 27 2003, 02:25 AM |
| "Selene has a very good point." "Like she said some questions are menat for you to figure out by yourself. God may want you to struggle through them trying to find your answer because he knows that it will bring you closer to Him." "God works in mysterious ways and we may never know how he works until we meet him one day." "Until next time, May God be with all of you!" |
| Posted by: Rachel Ferguson Aug 28 2003, 12:43 AM |
| Rachel pops her head in the FCMP meeting room. "And also with you Apollo!" (ooc: we better at least rp a little bit---did you read Hagrids new rules..... ) |
| Posted by: Selene_Pendragon Aug 28 2003, 04:45 AM |
| Selene waves at Rachel's at the door. Returning back to her conversation, "I don't think that we'll even know God's ways on the day we meet him! To tell you the truth, we're nothing compared to God! I really doubt it highly that he'll tell us his ways. Yes I know he loves us and all, but do you really think he would tell us his ways of working??? Like my old 7th grade muggle teacher told this to us: 'We are such a stupid and clueless race if compared to God. Compared to God and his works, we're smart enough to push the button down to make toast! Maybe not even!' Ah, such words of wisdom!" |
| Posted by: Apollo Phoebus Aug 28 2003, 08:36 PM |
| Apollo turns and waves at Rachel. "WellI suppose you can look at it that way. But I believe that God will answer questions that you have about why He did something. I think that if it is really important that He will give you a good explanation. I think that if it is a big enough problem in your life He will help you to find the answer." "ANd OMG guess what?????  ""MY religion teacher told me that there is a gospel of Peter. Like Saint Peter the first Pope. ANd it is sooooo funny. It has a bunch of stories about Jesus when he was a little kid. It has stories like 'when Jesus was a kid and other kids were picking on Him, Jesus would use his Godly powers to make birds fly at the other boys and then have them blow up!" "I think that is sooo hilarious. That is why it isnt in the Bible." "HAHAHAHAHAHA" |
| Posted by: Kai Porter Aug 28 2003, 10:53 PM |
| Kai looked a little worried, "You don't believe it, do you? Jesus lived a pure childhood, as we never could have even attempted..." |
| Posted by: Apollo Phoebus Aug 28 2003, 11:21 PM |
| Tunrs and sees Kai. "Oh of course not, but I think htat it is funny htat one of the greatest person in the Catolic fait hwould write something like that!" HAHAHA |
| Posted by: Kai Porter Aug 29 2003, 01:56 AM |
| Kai wiped his brow, "Phew. You scared me." (ooc: I'm starting a youth club ((the JESUS FREAKS)) at my school, please pray for us) (also ooc: I was digging through my files and found this, I find it encouraging, and I don't remember when I wrote it. Please tell me what you think) Freed From my prison, A bird set loose from a cage, By the grace of my Lord and God. When darkness closed in And was all I could see, His radiant light cut into my life And threw wide the door. Into His merciful arms I fell Gave my soul to Him. Then we embraced Holy Father, Repentant Son. He held my hand And kissed both my cheeks Forgave me of my faults. “Follow Me,” was His command So in His footsteps I will tread. And when again the darkness attacks And plagued by doubt I slow, I have only to look down, And on the path I’ll see The prints of the Lord, In the dirt Right Next To Prints… Left… By… Me |
| Posted by: Rachel Ferguson Aug 29 2003, 02:57 AM |
| It's a great poem Kai....sounds like one I've read before. Rachel turned to Apollo. "I don't really understand what you just said.  Is that somethign Peter said to be funny...or did he think that was actually an account...sorry just a bit lost......heh...) |
| Posted by: Selene_Pendragon Aug 29 2003, 06:16 AM |
| "Wait a minute...I've heard that poem before..." Selene thinks hard. "Duh! The Coco House! I just wrote a paragraph about the Soul of America and it has to sound all cool and stuff and i think i'm going to fail that because i just wrote random words....Just to let you guys know becuase i know how much you care and all (I'm just kidding by the way) Oh and here's another little fact: I'm not mad at Apollo anymore becuase I'm an immature little brat that is just too selfish. (and no I don't want to talk about it because it's embarrasing to my health!) |
| Posted by: Apollo Phoebus Aug 30 2003, 07:16 AM |
| Turns to Rachel. "Well Rachel it is a recorded book written by Peter. It talks about Jesus' life as a child. And it says stuff like Jesus used his godly powers to fight people. It is sooo funny. And i was just saying that it is funny that one of the greatest men in the Bible would do that." "OK Selene I am soo glad that you arent mad at me anymore and I wont ask y u were!" |
| Posted by: Rachel Ferguson Aug 30 2003, 05:22 PM |
| *Scratches chin* "Innnnteresting. I've definately never even heard about it....." |
| Posted by: Apollo Phoebus Sep 1 2003, 12:57 AM |
| Looks at Rachel. "Heard about what?" |
| Posted by: Kai Porter Sep 1 2003, 03:21 AM |
| Kai walks in, rubbing sleep from his eyes. "Hey, what's happening?" he asked, "Still on about that peter fellow?" |
| Posted by: Rachel Ferguson Sep 1 2003, 04:08 AM |
| "That book that Peter wrote. That's interesting though!" Oh, and today my pastor gave an interesting sermon about anger, and how Christians should be slow to anger. He remarked that all to often people just blow up at others without realizing how trivial the things are. I thought thatwas a good point in todays world because everyone gets so attached to material things and never even thinks how much God has blessed them with the people in theirlives! He also talked about how you can recognize some people by what they look like or how they dress, but Christians are alittle different. You can tell a Christian by their love!! I just thought that was really cool! |
| Posted by: Kai Porter Sep 1 2003, 04:12 AM |
| Odd. I was just thinking along those lines. God has his ways, yeah? |
| Posted by: Rachel Ferguson Sep 1 2003, 04:12 PM |
| "Lol He surrrrre does!" |
| Posted by: chloe mccrinkle Sep 3 2003, 10:03 PM |
| I'd like to join... Name - Chloe McCrinkle House - Hufflepuff! Year - 1st |
| Posted by: Rachel Ferguson Sep 4 2003, 01:34 AM |
| Rachel smiled at the new girl. "Hello and welcome to FCMP!" She grabbed the girls arm and pulled her over to the overstuffed chairs crammed into the small room. "This is Kai Porter, Selene Pendragon and Apollo Phoebus. We're so glad you could join us!" |
| Posted by: Selene_Pendragon Sep 4 2003, 06:39 AM |
Selene scoots over so she is scrunched up between the couch arm and Apollo and his bug booty. "Hello cloe!" She said, trying to get some air. "I'm Selene! How...are...you?" Selene tried to say as she attempted to free herself from being sat on by the entire group.  |
| Posted by: Kai Porter Sep 4 2003, 11:17 PM |
| "Hey," said kai as he walked in..."Did I miss anything?" |
| Posted by: Apollo Phoebus Sep 5 2003, 02:33 AM |
| Pushes Selene out of the way, to make room for his big butt. "Hey cloe!" What is up? Looks at Selene, 'You should tell her about the CoCo House' "CLoe since Selene wont do it I will, Come to the CoCo House to hear poetry and alos we are going to be staring Hogwarts Clue soon. ALso anyone else who wants to play is welcome to come!" "Also Cloe talk about important questions u have so we can try and help u figure them put. OK!" |
| Posted by: Selene_Pendragon Sep 5 2003, 03:38 AM |
| "Eek! Random...Big...butt...in my...FACE!" Selene says as she tried to puch Apollo from squashing her like a little pancake! ((Yes pancake...it's one of the random words of the day today.)) "Ah Apollo, this place is a place to make friends and talk about God...not an advertising board! But since it's out, yeah." |
| Posted by: Apollo Phoebus Sep 6 2003, 10:00 PM |
| "Oh sorry Selene! I was just trying to help buisness." "Oh well!" "I apologize Rachel." |
| Posted by: Sebastian Kafka Sep 7 2003, 12:24 AM | ||
ok I know thi sos completely random and out of character so I shouldn't be posting but Hagrid you rock umm christian club? gets bit complicated, so many different varieties that contradict each other. Umm I don't think it would be worth starting an Jewish, athiest, existentialist nilist club would there? |
| Posted by: Rachel Ferguson Sep 7 2003, 01:16 AM |
| Rachel smiled at Apollo. "It's ok! As long as we know Who we're focusing on." She looked over at the new comer. "Hi! As Faith said earlier, this is a joint club of all the religions, so feel free to head up whatever kind you would like! So far it's been just christian with Selene, Apollo, Kai, (and chloe?) and I...but you're welcome to hold your meetings here too! By the way, my name's Rachel Ferguson." She held out her hand to the new guy, hoping he would feel accepted even through their differences. |
| Posted by: Sebastian Kafka Sep 7 2003, 01:29 AM |
| *Sebastian Kafka looked up at Rachel. "Hello, I'm sebastian Kafka, second year Ravenclaw, nice to meet you. as I said before I'm jewish, athiest, well almost completely an athiest, nilistic beliefs and existential ones, I like to keep things complicated. so um do you follow christianity to the bible stricktly? or do you favour a more free worshipping, sorry I'm facinated by christians for odd reasons about their faith, just see me as the nosty sceptical one." |
| Posted by: Rachel Ferguson Sep 7 2003, 02:01 AM |
| Rachel gave this new character a weirdish look, which she quickly replaced with a smile. "Well, I see you're quite an, er, mixture there. Personally, I follow the Bible rather closely, but not necessarily literally, if that makes sense. I believe it is the Word of God, but some aspects are meant more as symbols or examples than actual laws for living. I'm not quite sure I can explain it very well. If you don't mind my asking, how can you be Jewish and Atheist? They seem to be a bit of opposites...heh..." (ooc: did you mean nazi when you said notsy?  ) |
| Posted by: Sebastian Kafka Sep 7 2003, 02:55 AM |
| (OOC how can I be a jewish nazi? no I meant nosey, excuse my dyslexia.) "Well I'm Jewish by race, athiest by choice, thats how, judaism is a race as well as a religion. Um can I ask you a few questions about the bible then? I've read it and its always confused me. Well regarding some of the specific laws and how you would follow them. For instance I would like to sell my daughter into slavery, as sanctioned in Exodus 21:7. In this day and age, what do you think would be a fair price for her? I know that I am allowed no contact with a woman while she is in her period of menstrual uncleanliness (Lev. 15:19-24). The problem is, how do I tell? I have tried asking, but most women take offence. Lev. 25:44 states that I may indeed possess slaves, both male and female, provided they are purchased from neighbouring nations. A friend of mine claims that this applies to Mexicans, but not Canadians. Can you clarify? Why can't I own Canadians? I have a neighbour who insists on working on the Sunday (the Sabbath). In the book of Exodus verse 35:2 it clearly states he should be put to death. Am I morally obligated to kill him myself? " *Sebastian Kafka waited patiently and interestedly for a reply. |
| Posted by: Rachel Ferguson Sep 7 2003, 03:32 AM |
| Rachel opened her eyes wide. "Regardless of religion, slavery is wrong. I'm not sure how you were taught as you grew up, but people cannot be owned. You also have to remember that the Bible was written in a completely different time period. In Exodus, God was trying to stress the fact that He wanted s e x and worship separate. It says in my Bible as a footnote that this would help the Israelites prevent the diseases of the age. I believe I am the complete WRONG person for you to be asking about this---if you are atheist than you need to find some kind of spiritual guidance. My Christian beliefs will differ greatly. As a United Methodist my church believes that the Sabbath is day to be recognitious of the Lord and the works of God. As it says in the Bible, Jesus healed a man on the Sabbath, which caused the Jewish priests to go into uproar. He was showing how day is not the most important thing, it's a love for others." Rachel sighed. "I'm afraid we will have to end this discussion, as it can only lead to conflict and I'm under strict watch to keep this club peaceful. If you have more questions, I would suggest attending a church session tomorow and talking to a pastor personally. If you want to start your own section of this club for those who share your beliefs, please feel free to do so, but please do not comment on anything members of other religions wish to post." Rachel looked around the group. "I think we should go back to posting which religion we are at the top of our posts like before, just to clarify. Please read my previous post if you are anyway confused about how this club works. Thanks for coming, everyone is welcome, as long as we're all respectful." This said, she tiredly plopped back down into her chair. |
| Posted by: Sebastian Kafka Sep 7 2003, 03:54 AM |
| *Sebastian Kafka blinked his eyes slightyl at Rachels responce. "I didn't mean to offend you, it was just an on running joke I have with one of my friends who is a christian, I thought it'd be a nice ice breaker. I didn't mean to cause a fight. Umm I really don't think stating your religion is necessary, and ok then what sort of things do you discuss here? so I know when not to cross the line and get into philopshically attacking mode." |
| Posted by: Rachel Ferguson Sep 7 2003, 04:06 AM |
| A little blush creeping into her cheeks, Rachel smiled. "Sorry to kind of flip out on you there, I'm just everso protective of this little club. So far we just kind of talk about how our lives our going, prayer requests, that sort of thing. It's kind of like the SIN club except mostly rp'ed (orat least we try) and Christian-based." She smiled and shooK Sebastian's hand. "Nice to meet you." (ooc: i read a post in the Hospital Wing, is it true you're ...pregnant?) |
| Posted by: Sebastian Kafka Sep 7 2003, 04:12 AM |
(OOC it makes sence if you read the start of the RP at the Lake its called 'unexpected occurances' then moves on to the hospital wing, and yes I am pregnant  ) |
| Posted by: Selene_Pendragon Sep 7 2003, 08:15 AM |
| Selene sees someone new walk in. "Ah cripes! Another one to squash the little one!" Somehow managing to get up from under Apollo's booty, she sits down on the comfy lounge chair. "fresh air...." answering one of the many questions of Sebastian's, "Ah me and the Bible aren't that great of friends...I believe the faith between God and his people should be felt and discovered. Not read in a book! I like reading the Bible though! I think of it as a great and very interesting book. So much adventure and mystery! Don't get me wrong, I take the Bible very seriously, but I just don't want to base my life off of what is in a book!" ((Jewish nazi...talk about your oxymorons!! lol)) |
| Posted by: Kai Porter Sep 8 2003, 11:43 PM |
| "HEY!" Kai burst through the door, completely oblivious to all conversation around him. "My Friend Alex is having her Bat Mitzfa (or however you spell it) Yah!" he began to dance happily then on a sadder note also added, "and I'd like to remind you to keep my family in your prayers. My Aunt is still having serious problems and is totally mad at my family because they're trying to help her, but not in the way she thinks they should." He sat down and ran his fingers through his hair distractedly. He couldn't tell them the whole truth about his aunt, because his mother had forbidden it, saying that they needn't burden anyone with their own troubles, so he wouldn't. It was still hard though... |
| Posted by: Sebastian Kafka Sep 9 2003, 12:47 AM |
| *Sebastian Kafka grinned "Oh have fun at the bat mitzfah, lots of dancing and making a fool out of yourself to be had." |
| Posted by: Rachel Ferguson Sep 9 2003, 02:32 AM |
| Rachel's heart went out to Kai. "I'll keep you in my prayers. Oh, and also my friend Morgan's going through a hard time too with her own family. *sigh*." |
| Posted by: Selene_Pendragon Sep 9 2003, 04:08 AM |
Selene gives Rachel and Kai a big hug. "Still in my prayers Kai and Rachel! And can you guys pray for me becuase I have an EXTREMELY hard test tomorrow. My teacher says that it's so hard, only 1/4 of the class will pass it  But he says don't stress over it becuase it's not that hard! Yeah right...." |
| Posted by: Rachel Ferguson Sep 9 2003, 02:08 PM |
| Rachel hugged Selene right back. "I'm sure you'll do your very best! And we'll be rooting for you from this end!" She crossed her fingers and winked at Selene. "Oh, and by the way, my parents started this new Bible study called Bad Girls of the Bible. It's a study about the "women of questionable virtue", such as Lot's wife (turned into a pillar of salt)and Eve (ya know, ate the apple, first sin, yeah..) and its really really interesting because it puts into perspective how hard their lives had been (or rather, easy in Eve's case, the author talked about how she had only known pleasure and happiness and had no reason not to try theapple---according to the author we can't develop character unless we've been through good times and bad) , and how it's always seen as their fault even though the husband did some bad stuff too. Rather new view..." |
| Posted by: Selene_Pendragon Sep 10 2003, 12:49 AM |
| Selene runs into the room clutching a piece of paper, apparently very excited and happy. "Guess what guys? I am proud to say that I was one of the 1/4 of the class that passed that test! Yay!" She pins it up in her own special corner of the room. "Ah! It's time for me to throw another party for myself! |
| Posted by: Rachel Ferguson Sep 10 2003, 01:06 AM | ||
| *claps wildly* Rachel promptly pinned a large sparkly sign on the wall.
|
| Posted by: Selene_Pendragon Sep 10 2003, 03:45 AM |
| "Yay! I've never had people at my special parties before! Cooooool! GOD DOESN'T WANT ME TO FAIL! That's good to know..." |
| Posted by: Apollo Phoebus Sep 10 2003, 05:18 AM |
| "Wow! I miss a lot when I am night here!" "SO well I hate my religion teacher!" "He is so bad at teaching and he is totally teaching all my classmates that the first eleven chapters og Genesis are completely fake! THey never happened!" "I HATE HIM! |
| Posted by: Selene_Pendragon Sep 10 2003, 06:21 AM |
| Selene looks at Apollo sympathetically. " 'hate' is such a strong word!" She continues to jump up and down when her randomness pops into gear. "You know, at my old muggle school, I just one day called the soda machine an evil, demonic monster from the firey bowls of hell's halls. And my buddy Jessi thought I was talking to her and said 'thank you!'. Haha...good times those were..." ((btw, that happened today at lunch when the machine bit me )) |
| Posted by: Rachel Ferguson Sep 10 2003, 02:09 PM |
| Lol....um.....no comment...... That really stinks about your religion teacher Apollo...howmuch longer do you have him/her? |
| Posted by: Apollo Phoebus Sep 11 2003, 02:09 AM |
| "Selene I love you!" "You are sooo random!" "Well Rachel I have him the rest of the year!" "I dont think I have ever hated someone soooo much!" |
| Posted by: Selene_Pendragon Sep 11 2003, 02:21 AM |
| "That really sucks Apollo! You know what this reminds me of? D.A.! Teach yourself! That would be fun!" |
| Posted by: Kai Porter Sep 11 2003, 11:16 PM |
| ooc: I can almost compare. My SS teacher this year is so UNFAIR! We had to do a project, and we almost failed because people didn't help, and the people that did the project still got a sorry grade. |
| Posted by: Ayumi Sep 11 2003, 11:31 PM |
| WHAT WE ALMOST FAILED!!!!!!!!!TELL ME WE DIDN'T HOW DID WE ALMOST FAIL????? |
| Posted by: Kai Porter Sep 11 2003, 11:34 PM |
| ooc:ayumi, if you'd come to class you'd have known. It was all N's fault for coulouring in Mexico. and H's for talking the whole time. Me Bla and M did all the work today. (to everybody else, sorry for this off topic post) |
| Posted by: Ayumi Sep 11 2003, 11:39 PM |
| ooc:i think i know who did all the talking :cough cough Push up grl cough cough:Hey does Rachel mind Messianic Jews joing her club???Its the same thing |
| Posted by: Kai Porter Sep 11 2003, 11:49 PM |
| Who, you mean MD? no, it was like all guys in the back like Derrick and Matt. And sure, you can join. As long as we don't start killing each other like we did at the lake. |
| Posted by: Ayumi Sep 11 2003, 11:54 PM |
| Ooc:Just took a life long shower to get the mud out of my hair lol.Naw i don't thinkg we'll kill each other here but how bout at skool lol j/k: |
| Posted by: Rachel Ferguson Sep 12 2003, 12:22 AM |
| Rachel smiled at Ayumi. "No I don't mind, all religions can meet here, as long as you specify what religon you're talking about and don't criticize anyone elses beliefs!" She smiled warmly and pulled a bag of Wheat-Thins out of her robes. "I always feel so blessed by God on September 11th. I don't know if any of you aren't from America, but it was a rather poignant day 2 years ago exactly. I just can't believe how blessed I am/was that none of my family were hurt. The thought haunts me every time." |
| Posted by: Selene_Pendragon Sep 12 2003, 03:17 AM |
| OOC: Yep...I'm so confused, but I guess it doesn't matter. Selene wiped her eyes with her hankerchief. "September 11th....It still brings a tear to my eyes. I remember exactly what I was doing two years ago. I felt like I wanted to help, but I lived on the other side of the country! I nearly cried in school. Do you guys remember what you were doing when you found out?" Rachel pulled out a bag of...food! "Ooooh...Wheat-Thins..." |
| Posted by: Rachel Ferguson Sep 12 2003, 02:18 PM |
| Rachel nodded grimly. "Yeah, I was in my Geography class, and thought it was some terriblle attack in another country or something. We hardly did any ork all day in my classes, just watched the news. That is, until my principal thought it was "too graphic" for us...and made us turn it off. A few people prayed together, and it was jsut a really hard day that brought everyone together. " She grabbed a few wheat thins and munched loudly. |
| Posted by: Ayumi Sep 12 2003, 11:58 PM |
| ooc:Just to let you guys know that a Messianic Jew is basicly the same as a christian but just with jewish blood.We believe that Jesus (Yeshua in hebrew) is the savior. So we believe in the new testament unlike the Reformed and Orthadox Jews. We are HATED by the other Jew's which is realy sad, since they believe that we aren't following the "true Jewish religion" or what ever you want to call it. So they can't stand to even have the word Messianic mentioned to them. If you do it on the phone they'll hang up on you or say very nasty things to you (trust me I know).I just wanted to let you know what a Messianic Jew is just in case you didn't know. If i write Yeshua its cuz i'm used to that, but it means Jesus. Baruch Ha Shem (bless the name) |
| Posted by: Rachel Ferguson Sep 13 2003, 12:27 AM |
| "Oh, wow, yeah I didn't know that! Awesome! Well welcome even more!" She glanced around quickly, of course not wanting to offend anyone. "It will be great to have another perspective. I can't believe people are still judging based on religion, it seems so....Medieval. I know people will always have their little set views, but gosh life's just not long enough!" |
| Posted by: Ayumi Sep 13 2003, 01:04 AM |
| Thanks! I'm proud to be a member of this club. Its good that we have a club where we can talk bout things that realy matter like G-d and the bible. |
| Posted by: Apollo Phoebus Sep 13 2003, 04:23 AM |
| "WoW I missed a lot!" "Oh well so ayumi do you know Hebrew?" "I would love to learn the language, I think it is sooooo cool!!!!" "YEah September 11th was bad! My school had a "PRayer Service" And it had nothing to do with 9-11" "It was soo stupid!" |
| Posted by: Ayumi Sep 13 2003, 04:36 AM |
| Yeah i know hebrew.Its acutally realy easy to learn. I'm having my bat mitzvah 12/20/03 can't wait!! |
| Posted by: Apollo Phoebus Sep 13 2003, 04:55 AM |
| "WOW!" "Congrats! So did u have to go to Hebrew school?" |
| Posted by: Ayumi Sep 13 2003, 05:01 AM |
| No i just had a Hebrew tutor from my snyagoge,she's the one who's helping me with my portion. |
| Posted by: Kai Porter Sep 13 2003, 03:46 PM |
| "Alright!" Kai gave Ayumi a high five. "Welcome to the club. At least your school had something. We had...hm...well a soldier came and talked for like half an hour but that was about it. Nobody said anything. We weren't even encouraged to wear patriatic clothes. And Yeah. I remember. I was in Mr. E's third period social studies class. He turned on the news. Me and Ayumi were praying the whole period weren't we Ayumi?" He looked at her, "Unfourtunately we weren't really saved yet so it didn't count....We both got saved this summer at different youth camps." |
| Posted by: Rachel Ferguson Sep 13 2003, 04:29 PM |
| Oh, wow, I'd always grown up in the Methodist church, but never really focused on God seriously until I went to a youth camp in Texas. It was a huge experience; I guess I woud consider that when i was saved. We hiked up this huge hill and just when we were about to pass out from walking we got to the top where there was this enormous cross. It was just then sunset too andthe sun was behind it, man it was amazing. *reflects, munching on wheat thins* |
| Posted by: Kai Porter Sep 13 2003, 06:19 PM |
| Texas youth Camps rule. I was at Lake Lavon Youth Camp. Our speaker was David Crain. We just did a lot of bible study but it was so moving. I cried a lot |
| Posted by: Random Sep 13 2003, 06:48 PM |
| Random casually leans against the door frame and listens to the discussion with a passive expression on her face. |
| Posted by: Sebastian Kafka Sep 13 2003, 06:50 PM | ||
Um just want to say I'm an orthadox Jew...well athiest typre jew to be honest but I don't hate messianic Jews, everyone is entitled to their own beliefs...well even if I do dissagree extremely with some peoples beliefs...umm but as long as we all love and hug and glomp! hehe sorry I'm in a dopey happy mood, not much sleep last night Sebastian |
| Posted by: Kai Porter Sep 13 2003, 06:54 PM |
| Well, I think I'll pray for you, Sebastion. I know we're not supposed to push our beliefs, but I don't want to know ANYONE who goes to hell....It would make me sad.... |
| Posted by: Selene_Pendragon Sep 13 2003, 06:59 PM |
| ((Wow...I sure missed a lot in one night!)) "Whoa Kai...what are you talking about? Yeah...I was a wiccan/christian. But them magick days are over. I'm a full time catholic now! I went to a retreat just in the woods with my Life Teen group. We had a 2 hour adoration and it totally changed my life!" |
| Posted by: Kai Porter Sep 13 2003, 07:06 PM |
| Anyone who does not accept Jesus Christ as their personal Messiah and Savior is condemed to hell. It's the truth, and I pray for people who don't know him every night. O Jews are still waiting for their Messiah, which means they Don't believe that Jesus is the Messiah. |
| Posted by: Random Sep 13 2003, 07:44 PM |
| The Hufflepuff girl standing in the doorway snorts. |
| Posted by: Rachel Ferguson Sep 13 2003, 10:04 PM |
| Rachel cast a sharp look at Kai. "No criticizing Kai. They can believe whatever they want, remember?" She forced a smile, but kept an eye on him. She had noticed a girl standing in the doorway, but figured she would enter when she was ready. "Everyone has to know that they are welcome here." She munched on a few more wheat thins. |
| Posted by: Ayumi Sep 13 2003, 10:10 PM |
| Sorry, I hope i didn't offend u in any way Sebastian.The only Orthadox Jew's I know have either cursed me out or flipped me of.May I ask why u are atheist? Its ok if you don't want to tell, I'll understand. Onto happier subject. I went to Camp Elijah in Texas.Boy I hated it at first. There were to many freakin rules.And our councilers wouldn't let us hang w/ the guyz. I quote "You guyz can't go downstairs since their our boyz there" But then we went to praise and worship and things got better from their. It was totally emotional kinda hard to explain but those that got saved know what I'm talking about. GO TEXAS YOUTH CAMPS!!! |
| Posted by: Kai Porter Sep 14 2003, 01:46 AM |
| I know Rachel. I know. I just...well...I just want them to know I care, ok? And how can you be a Wiccan and a Christian, Selene? That's like an Oximoron *sp?* I know I sound all biased, but I just know the truth...and I want everyone to. And Random, either come in and state your mind or go away. (sorry, I know I sound like I'm in a bad mood, I just...I dunno. Maybe I am...) |
| Posted by: Sebastian Kafka Sep 14 2003, 03:31 AM |
| my father was jewish, I was brought up as a orthadox jew Ayumi I suppose I'm not a complete athiest, its just I can't believe there could be a good when the world is like this, or if there is one I'd have to say he is an underachiever. alot of things have happened in my life and I can't see anymore thats theres some good all powerful all loving force that is supposed to be guiding us. When I was little me and my twin sister used to look up to the sky and prey. Now I Looked at sky through smoke heavy with human fat and God was not there. The cold, suffocating dark goes on forever and we are alone. Live our lives, lacking anything better to do; Devise reason later. Born from Oblivion, bear children, hell-bound as ourselves, go into Oblivion. There is nothing else. Existence is random; has no pattern save what we imagine after staring at it too long; no meaning save what we choose to impose. This rudderless world is not shaped by vague metaphysical forces. It is not God who kills the children. Not Fate that butchers them or Destiny that feeds them to the dogs. It's us. Only us. And sorry if I went off into a ramble there, this is a tricky subject for me, plus I don't think being raped by priests when I was eigth years old helped, somehow staring into the face of Jesus on the cross in the back of a church whilst things that should be confined to the adult world are thrust upon you don't tend to instate your belief in any sort of God. (feel free to get angry at my responce now oh and Kai I'll have fun in hell, I seem to rememerb they liked athiest bisexual people who like commiting sins )EDIT *shoots tyops and damn dyslexic self* |
| Posted by: Rachel Ferguson Sep 14 2003, 04:25 AM |
| Breathe Rachel, BREATHE she told herself fiercely, trying with all her self control not to flip out. "Sebastian, I can not come within a million miles of knowing even a little bit of what you've been through, and I cannot explain why they happened or why God did not intervene. All I can say is that know He loves you, I know its absolutely impossible to you and I completely understad how hard it must be, but I just don't know what I can say. I will pray that somehow, in someone, God will reveal Himself to you in a positive way." |
| Posted by: Random Sep 14 2003, 05:53 AM |
| Random quietly turns and leaves with her hands stuffed into her pockets. |
| Posted by: Selene_Pendragon Sep 14 2003, 08:51 AM |
| ((I apologize to everyone because this might seem like I'm yelling and ranting. I'm just not feeling very well and I'm extremely tired.)) Sorry to break your heart Kai, but it's impossible to know the truth about God. Sure, some of his works and teachings are in the Bible but there's more. If you think on our judgement day, God is going to ask if we were a catholic or jewish or buddhist or wiccan you couldn't be more blind. I don't understand God (No human on this earth is capable) but I highly doubt that God is going to send you to heaven or hell based on your religion. God is going to ask whether we fed his people or clothed the naked and that stuff...you know, the BEATITUDES and COMMANDMENTS. EDIT: and remember: Jesus was Jewish. The Jews was the chosen people. I don't think he's about to damn his own people. If you are going to pray for someone, pray for satanic people. Those that rejected God and worship the devil would need our prayers more than the Jews. I beleive that God will send us to where we want to go. Like, those that worship Satan will want to go to hell. And being a wiccan and a catholic is not an oxymoron. Everyone thinks that wiccans sacrifice people or worship the devil and they couldn't be more farther from the truth. Some magic is good.... I'm not even going to explain to you guys how I was a wiccan and still be a catholic at the same time. Have you even studied or practiced or know anything about the magic life? If not, don't automatically assume their beliefs. And can we please get off this topic? We're all going to get into fights and that won't be good. They might close this place.... So we need to get on a more better topic. |
| Posted by: Rachel Ferguson Sep 14 2003, 02:29 PM |
| *cough* AMEN! *cough*(ooc: to her last sentence) |
| Posted by: Virginia Abette Sep 14 2003, 05:10 PM |
| "Hello everyone." Ginny said very quietly, standing in the doorway. |
| Posted by: Rachel Ferguson Sep 14 2003, 06:42 PM |
| Rachel smiled at Ginny. "Hello, welcome to FCMP! Have a seat! This is Kai, Selene, Sebastian, Apollo, Ayumi and Chloe, and blast I know I forgot someone but im in such a rush!" (ooc:family thing!) |
| Posted by: Selene_Pendragon Sep 14 2003, 07:39 PM |
| "Ooooh...new person! Welcome Ginny!" |
| Posted by: Apollo Phoebus Sep 14 2003, 07:55 PM |
| "WoW! So much to comment on, I dont know where to start?" "WEll I was "saved" when i went on a retrreat with my teen group and I had the greatest experiences! I saw jesus' face!" "It was so calming!" "Well anyway Sebastian I m sorry and I cant comfort you, except for saying that there is a God and if you want to be saved then ask for it!" "Kai, buddy, listen Wicca is voer rated, everyone thinks that it is all about poeple in black! WEll it isnt I believe that people make it like that and they therefore give it a bad name! And there is sucha thing as black magic! Those people will be sent to hell!" "Well Selene is a very cool person and you shouldnt judge someone because you are ignorant about the subject!" "Sorry to get so angry, but it is the truth!" "Oh and welcome Ginny!" |
| Posted by: Kai Porter Sep 14 2003, 08:42 PM | ||
Ok, I'll lay off, but Let me reply to this first, deal? God doesn't care if you're Catholic or Baptist, or Budhist or whatever. He just wants you to accept the gift he gave when he sent his son, right? And he doesn't want to damn anyone. he loves us all the same. Gentiles, Jews. Jesus was Jewish as part of a prophocy. He was sentenced by the Gentiles, and his followers were killed by Jews. Not by any rightiousness of our own are we saved. It is not through good deeds that we will see the Kingdom of heaven. Only the blood of Jesus can do that. You can do good deeds till you die, and I believe that without Jesus you will perish. The blood of Adam runs in your veins, and thus his sin. The blood of Adam and the sin of Adam is in all of us. THat is why the virgin birth is such a big deal. No Earth Father, no Adam's Sin. You have to atone for your sins, and your father's sin, and your father's father's father's sins. It's written. God will send us to Heaven or to Hell. I know I'm going to Heaven because of his promis that whoever accepts Jesus and believes with all their heart will live forever in his eternal kingdom. Those who reject him, or just plain don't know or believe, will go to eternal death. Selene, I didn't mean to insult you about Wiccans. I just jumped to a conclution last night. You are right, on the subject of wiccans, I am ignorant. I will trust you, but my experiance and understanding was not a good one up to this point. Sorry. I had to have my final say. I will now drop the subject, and apologize if I ruined the club. |
| Posted by: Sebastian Kafka Sep 14 2003, 09:17 PM | ||||
First of all Kai you haven't ruined the club, were having a debate, we just have to be careful not to cross the line to insults...something I'm not good at I'll admit. *likes theological debates* Now I don't personally believe Jesus was the son of good, or resurected, or saved us from our sins, I beleived he was a man that lived and tralked and spread something very valuable, morals and tolerance and love in life. Further more if a religion stated that you will go to heaven for believing in your heart that jesus died for our sins was soon of God etc, but you went around hurting people, murdering peopel would you still go to heaven? suely to live a good life and be loving and helpful to others is more important then what your ancesters might have done, I personally don't want to be judged by what my parents have done. Now I'm don't know chrsitianity in depth but if that is true Kai then its a religion that is deeply confussed about itself. But then again life is confusing so maybe its ok for religion to be too But I would believe in Jesus if only God would give me some clear sign! Like making a large deposit in my name in a Swiss bank. Sebastian |
| Posted by: Kai Porter Sep 14 2003, 10:17 PM | ||
Well, if you truely repented from your sins and stoped, then yes, God would forgive you. If you really believe that, it's obvious in the life you live. And sometime we stray from the path of god, and have to be reminded who gave us birth, brought us from the dust with the soul purpose to worship HIM. God created us. He didn't need us. We need him. He created us because even before we were born, he loved us. That's a little hard to immagine with the puny human brain I have. anyway, back on topic, Everyone has sinned. I mean, even little schoolboys say bad things, and steal and lie. Those are all sins. To murdur someone in your mind is just as bad as pulling the trigger on them. Christianity is either the whole truth or the biggest scam that ever was. Even I admit that. We argue amongst ourselves, and do not set much of an example, I know. Especially the babtists. But I choose to believe with all my heart and soul that jesus was who he says he was. You either believe that he's telling the truth, or that he's lying. If you don't believe Jesus, but you believe the rest of the bible or Torah or whatever, then i think there's a problem. Just like some people say, well, I believe in this, but I can't immagine god would say that. Well, you either believe it all or none. I'm running out of juice. *rubs eyes* I'll say more later. I would never insult someone on purpose (or at least with the purpose of insulting them) also...what more sign do you want? I mean, all this stuff is predicted. Jesus fulfills more than 109 clear seperate prophocies concerning his Messiahship alone.... |
| Posted by: Rachel Ferguson Sep 14 2003, 11:01 PM |
| Just a note to both of you, thanks both to Kai and Sebastian for being very respectful in both of your posts *hugs for you both*! Rachel flipped quickly through her Bible to the verse she was looking for. "Ok, here in John 1:27 It talks about how you are a Christian by your love; it what you do for others, not what you say that makes you a true Christian. I fully believe that people who go around commiting sins and then go to church on sundays are complete hypocrites and definately not yet saved by Jesus. I agree with Kai about how Jesus has fulfilled the prophecy, and yes He was the perfect life, undefiled by sin. He gave us an example--it's our gift to God to follow it and Him. " |
| Posted by: Kai Porter Sep 14 2003, 11:08 PM |
| Kai hugged Rachel back, although this hug was more out of gratitude than the deep affection between them. "Thanks Rach. I was begining to think I was all alone over here!" My favorite verse (and I should have included this in my last post) is Hebrews 11:1 For faith is being sure of what we hope for, and certain of what we do not see. You can't see air, can you? and yet you never question it's existance. You can't see when bacteria is attacking you from the inside before you become ill, but you know it's there, don't you? It is the same with the Lord. He's there, we just are blind, that's all. |
| Posted by: Ayumi Sep 14 2003, 11:09 PM |
| Sebastian, have you ever been to a messianic snyagogue before? |
| Posted by: Kai Porter Sep 14 2003, 11:14 PM |
| Kai jumped up and down, having a slightly ooc moment, "ooh ooh! I have, Ayumi! I have!" |
| Posted by: Ayumi Sep 14 2003, 11:17 PM |
| Wonder who took you*Ayumi raises her perfectly arched eye brows* |
| Posted by: Kai Porter Sep 14 2003, 11:19 PM |
| Good question...I give up. |
| Posted by: Ayumi Sep 14 2003, 11:26 PM |
| "Hmm was it Jeremiah?"she asked sarcasticly |
| Posted by: Kai Porter Sep 14 2003, 11:52 PM |
| Who?" asked Kai innocently. He didn't think it fair to reveal his friend's crush on the net...."Why, I remember now...Your dad took us, and then he out ran me. That was SO embarasssing..." Maybe he should say something... |
| Posted by: Ayumi Sep 14 2003, 11:54 PM |
| Lol you finally remember. My 50 yr old dad BEAT YOU!!! No excuses.lol. |
| Posted by: Kai Porter Sep 14 2003, 11:58 PM |
| He cheated. I KNOW it. And besides. I was carrying packages. He wasn't (no excuses? I thought you knew me....) So, heard from Jerimiah? |
| Posted by: Ayumi Sep 15 2003, 12:02 AM |
no i'm goin one last time this week.After the cross country meet  Our assistant rabbia is doing awsome!!! I'll tell you the rest tommarrow.Our prayer has been answered!!! G-d is good!! |
| Posted by: Kai Porter Sep 15 2003, 12:03 AM |
| All the Time, All the time. |
| Posted by: Sebastian Kafka Sep 15 2003, 12:50 AM | ||
not to be picky and scientific or anything but... hehe you can see air, there are experients whihc air is placed into water, ertain chemicals to start reacts etc (sorry my tiny brains refuses to rememebr the exact experients after a summer out of school) And bacteria is visable through microscopes, using certains dyes. We don't know the lord is there, we can never know for CERTAIN either way, you believe in your heart that God exists and is there to love and guide you. In a way I envy that true faith and belief, I suppose its the crosses athierst have to year that they yearn to belive, but I just truely cannot, I suppose I can't get past all the suffering and evil in the world to an all loving, all powerful entity. As it is I believe passionately in nothing, I have a zest of non belief. And Ayumi I haven't ever been to a Messianic synagogue, its a long time since I've been to a synagogue in any shape or form. |
| Posted by: Kai Porter Sep 15 2003, 12:56 AM |
| *sigh* i meant with bare eyes. You have to preform an experiment to see it, then it doesn't really count. anyway that was a quote from an old old old dude who died a long time ago. And again. I KNOW he's tehre. I feel Him. I see Him. He loves me, and you, and everybody. Even the druggies and the murderers and the Rapists. Besides. Where else could the world have come from. I'm insulted that some one would tell me, you came from an ape. Not to mention. Ok, then where did the Ape come from....etc.... |
| Posted by: Sebastian Kafka Sep 15 2003, 01:12 AM |
| why doesn't seeing things through experimentation count? surely the whole of the modern world was forged upon expermenting to see new things and find out new cures for diseases etc. You BELEIVE he is there, you believe oyu see and feel him and that he loves oyu and all, you can never know, you may believe it with all your heart and soul, but you can never truely know it. Just because there isn't necessarily an answer for many questions in life, such as where did the world come from, it doesn't mean that there must be a God to have made them, God is one answer that has been put forth to the question, one suggestion. Life is at the start, a chaos in which one is lost. Frightened of finding ourself face to face with this terrible reality, we try to cover it over with a curtain of fantasy. it is my belief that the origins of religions are part of this curtin. When people didn't know what caused the storms, the rain or lack of it from the sky, why we became ill, it was only natural to believe something beyond us caused it, we didn't understand so it must be something so much bigger and powerful then us that did these things. And I personally agree with mr Darwin that we EVOLVED from apes, apes evolves from other creatures a very long long time ago over a process of millions of years extremely slowely, it is believed that we evolved from single moleculed organisms that have very little resemblance to mordern man. Why do you see it as an insult to think that you might have millions of years ago resembled an ape? out chemistry and physiology is extremely simular, this respoince always intrigues me. Sebastian |
| Posted by: Kai Porter Sep 15 2003, 02:49 PM |
| Ok, if you want to believe in another life you ate termites, more power to you. God has proven himself time and time again, for those who look for his signs. One day everyone is going to be forced to admit it, its those who look to him now that will be rewarded. I can't PROVE anything to someone who doesn't want to see. I've already met someone via internet who has hardened their heart, and quite possibly has a demon. Again, I will pray that you will see, but I fear that without meeting you face-to-face that I can't really show you anything. |
| Posted by: Sebastian Kafka Sep 15 2003, 05:35 PM |
| *Sebastian Kafka sits down and eats um vegetable shaped termites (ok you get the idea, I'm a vegan so I wouldn't eat a real termite) I'd be interesting in which ways you feel God has proven himself, (sorry debating wh*re here) but one thing Kai, believe I have wanted to see, I suppose I still do. I was brought up to believe in God until the age of 6 when various things happened that made me question that belief. I envy my friends who have such a blind faith in something potentially so wonderful, but to me I can't beleive, I have tried and purged my soul searching. I'm here waiting for him to come to me but he hasn't. Hardened heart with a demon? do you belie such things cause peoples perceptions on life?people become hardened by life and all the terrible things in it, to say someone has a hardened heart is a little unfair. My girlfriend in RL is the most compassionate loving person I know, I partly believe this as she is having my kids so I know I'm a bit biased but I have never met someone so loving as her, she is also the most strict athiest I have ever met. Can one belie in something that is not necessarily true controll how your whole person is? some of the worse peopel I have met have also been christians, I'm not stereotyping them as some of my best friends are christians too, but if the people who in my life have caused me such pain, can they go to everlasting life, to a wonderful heaven meerly for believing in an entity that many choose not to question? |
| Posted by: Kai Porter Sep 15 2003, 09:16 PM |
| I believe you mean termite shaped veggies. How can I list all the things God has blessed me with? There are so many, like drops of water in the ocean...My Grandpa was cured of cancer, without the help of a doctor, is one of the first that comes to mind. The bible speaks of hardened hearts. You say it's unfair. Really? If so, then it is a crime to turn away God when he comes knocking time and time again with a gift to give? And yet so many doors are slammed in his face. The bible also speaks of Demons. they work for Satan, the accuser, and are his agents. They search for those who are weak in faith, and consume them. I'm not saying EVERYONE who doesn't believe is an agent of Satan, I just know there are some out there. i don't know what happened to you, but don't let Satan use it as an excuse to push away god. He's furious, because he knows his time as ruler of all earth is limited, and he wants to bring as many of us down with him as he can. Don't give him a foothold, because once you do, it's too late. No one can resist him without the help of the lord. Even the Arcangle Michael said, "the LORD rebuke you, Satan," calling on the lord to aid him. |
| Posted by: Ayumi Sep 15 2003, 11:02 PM |
| On the demon part yes i do beleive there out there.There out there to trick people in believing that theirs isn't a G-d out there.They can attactch themselves to weak people.You should be INSULTED to hear that we evolvode from an animal!!!!!! G-d made us in his image and if you don't beleive me read in genusis. |
| Posted by: Ayumi Sep 16 2003, 02:44 AM |
| G-d said, "Never will I leave you; never will I forsake you." the L-rd will come to you, for he keeps his promises and this verse is found in the bible Hebrews 13:5-6. He doesn't controll who you are, but you are acountable for your wrong doing by HA SHEM the L-rd of host. G-d says theres an enterinty what is there to question. He keeps his word, just as he said the Jew's were his choosen ppl and they still are today.But don't you remember what they have done...they've done enough wrong stuff for him to say "Hey,you've done horrible stuff so your not my choosen ppl anymore." He kept his promsice. BARUCH HABA, BESHEM ADONIA!! You need to pray for him to come to you to give you the answer and the understanding of word. And he will come to you.Regardless of the dissapointments in you've had in life,G-d is always there for you,and will come to your aid when you ask for him. Have you thought of speaking to your Rabbia,I've learned alot from Bar & Bat Mitzvah class, mabe you should go sit through a class or two. I hope that you will return to snyagogue one day,just sit through one service and listen,its not that bad trust me I go every week.And I don't do it because of force,I do it out of my own free will. May Adonai's shalom be with you, I declare Yeshua Hamachaic (Jesus the messiah) Shalom |
| Posted by: Sebastian Kafka Sep 16 2003, 03:42 AM |
| Ayumi, believe me I have hoped and preyed, he didn't come, I went to the synagogue and all that jazz. I think personally I have made up my mind that i am an athiest, no matter how much I perhaps didn't want to have to admit it to myself. Not to be rude or anything but I don't believe the bible speaks any form of truth, its more of a moral fiction guide, don't get me wrong its one of the greatest books ever written but it has as much historical value as a frozen haddock. It was written and told through word of mouth, made biased by the people who wrote each part, as a historical document it isn't whats known as 'primary evidence' its somewhere down int he 200th evidence in my opinion, and I'm ranting now because i haven't taken my lithium of late so you shall be offended probably by what I have written, well have fun, adious, I'm off to talk to the toaster. Sebastian Yedidya Kafka, the confused, slightly |
| Posted by: Kai Porter Sep 16 2003, 10:54 PM |
| I'm saddened by your decision, Sabastion. But, it isn't our job as Christians (and Mesianic Jews) to force you to believe. We are simply to inform you. We've given it our best shot, and have told you what we believe. When Jesus comes for us, remember our words, that you may yet have a chance. |
| Posted by: Ayumi Sep 16 2003, 10:55 PM |
| G-d wouldn't lie to his people. He keeps his promises. He wouldn't lie to us. I believe every single word in the bible |
| Posted by: Kai Porter Sep 16 2003, 10:57 PM |
| As do I. Thanks, Ayumi. But read my last post. We need to spend our time on people who WANT to know the truth. Like Guest 14 today. |
| Posted by: Ayumi Sep 16 2003, 11:01 PM |
| Trust me G-d wants to come to you. I hope you one day will believe what Kai and I have said,but it seems to me right now that you have been blinded. I hope you will take my advice about talking to a youth leader or rabbia so your eyes will be unvailed. The rapture is coming, its only a matter of time before it happens and when it does you will be left behind...... I'm sorry you feel this way about G-d but it seems that Kai and I can't get through to you. I hope you are happy with your desicion on being athiest. |
| Posted by: Rachel Ferguson Sep 17 2003, 12:24 AM |
| Rachel smiled at Sebastian. "It's your decision, and your's alone. We just want to make it easier!" She looked around at the other two, who she had discovered were also from Texas. "Did you two ever go to See You at the Pole? (for anyone who doesn't know this is when students all gather around the flagpole at 7in the morning to pray for others, schools, government etc. I've always wanted to do it, but never could. I ride the bus.)" |
| Posted by: Ayumi Sep 17 2003, 12:33 AM |
| We do!!!!!! Its kool. |
| Posted by: Rachel Ferguson Sep 17 2003, 12:55 AM |
| Awesome! Yeah, our's is tomorrow. I know a lot of people that are going....my church is hosting the "Saw you at the pole" youth rally tomorrow night. |
| Posted by: Kai Porter Sep 17 2003, 01:28 AM |
| But we can't go....WE GOT CROSS COUNTRY. RUNRUNRUNRUNRUNRUNRUN |
| Posted by: Sebastian Kafka Sep 17 2003, 01:53 AM |
| RUN RUN RUN RUN RUNNING! is fun fun fun fun have fun fun fun then on that run run run. And yes I think I am a happy athiest "I'm sort of an atheist. I like Jesus and all, but I don't care too much for most of the other stuff in the Bible. Take the Disciples, for instance. They annoyed the hell out of me, if you want to know the truth. They were all right after Jesus was dead and all, but while He was alive, they were about as much use to Him as a hole in the head. All they did was keep letting Him down. I like almost anybody in the Bible better than the Disciples. If you want to know the truth, the guy I like best in the Bible, next to Jesus, was that lunatic and all, that lived in the tombs and kept cutting himself with stones. I like him ten times as much as the Disciples, that poor *%$&." << sorry had to add that quote in, sums my thoughts up a bit. Um I was just wondering, what on earth is a youth leader? someone who leads youth off of cliffs like lemmings? *is deeply puzzled over her in england* |
| Posted by: Rachel Ferguson Sep 17 2003, 02:02 AM |
| Rachel laughed. "Actually a youth leader is usually an adult in the church who guides the youth (teens) in worship and bible study. Our's is amazing----they're like a reverend except easier for teenagers to understand." |
| Posted by: GregorSamsa Sep 17 2003, 02:19 AM | ||
Ok, I haven't posted here in a while so I'm out of the loop, but I read that and had to express my agreement. The way I see it at least, the Bible is full of folklore and bias. Also, the Bible is easy to misinterpret, but then again, we don't really know what the correct interpretation would be. The biggest thing is the translation. Obviously the Bible wasn't written in English, and so we read the translated version and depend upon the skills and honesty of the translators of many years ago. It would be so easy for a translator to change a meaning here or there to fit his or her liking without anybody being able to tell (I'm talking about kings who could use the Bible for their power benefit), or just the simple fact that meanings are lost in translations. This was pointed out to me by a teacher who I love dearly and used to have long religious chats with. Don't believe everything you read in the Bible word for word. Think for yourself, and come up with your own interpretations. |
| Posted by: Kai Porter Sep 17 2003, 03:36 AM |
| Ok, sorry, I didn't bite for sebastion, but two is two too many if you get what I'm saying. I take that quite personally. That book is the only book ever written without flaws. It is the word of GOD traslated through his profits. He said so. You either believe him TOTALLY or not at all. It doesn't work part way. |
| Posted by: GregorSamsa Sep 17 2003, 05:06 AM |
| I didn't say anything about the truth of the word of God or His prophets. I'm talking about the way it changes through the years and through translations and interpretations by other people (many years later). No offense intended. And I'm not saying you should point out parts of the Bible and say "I believe that" and "I don't believe that," I'm saying some parts don't mean exactly what people tell you or were originally intended to mean. Is that a bit clearer? I’m not trying to be sacrilegious, I swear! |
| Posted by: Sebastian Kafka Sep 17 2003, 07:19 PM |
| Yeah I think Gregor my metamorphosis pal summed up what I meant perfectly, you can believe in the bible wholely, but in the form you buy a copy of int he shops wasn't how it was originally written, tsake the two tails of Jesus's birth, um jimbob (no offence ment but I don't know what book its in) said that three kings visited the infant Jesus as he wanted Christianity to appeal to the wealthy when he writ it, and bobsire (again my lack of memory astounds me) wrote that three shepards visited baby Jesus as he wanted Chriatianity to appeal to common people. they kind of conflict don't they? peoples interpretations, translations and handing down of stories are always biased, albeit unconsciously in some cases. |
| Posted by: Kai Porter Sep 17 2003, 10:45 PM |
| Ok, I know you didn't mean to offend, but I still take offense. Just like if you said I was a dirty liar and then took it back. I believe God protects his word. |
| Posted by: Ayumi Sep 18 2003, 12:11 AM |
| GOSH, How do you people live without the word of the L-rd. Truly no one can live without the L-rd and be happy,you may think you are but your not.You have a piece missing in the puzzle and until that piece is place you'll be partly complete.I'm praying for you both so that the L-rd can open your eyes and guide you. I realy wish you guys would talk to someone about G-d....the rapture is coming do you think you'll be in heaven with Jesus or somwhere else completely lost. Make sure you realy think about your desicons.Even if you don't believe in G-d,you'll be answering to him |
| Posted by: Rachel Ferguson Sep 18 2003, 12:13 AM |
| Rachel put her hand to her chin and scunched up her face, thinking. "I believe that though it was translated, it is still the word of God and how He wants us to live our life. If it had been too blasphemous it wouldn't have been accepted in the first place, and many bilblical scholars who speak both have analyzed the translation and would have noticed large differences." |
| Posted by: GregorSamsa Sep 18 2003, 01:21 AM |
| It would be incredibly hard, after all these years, for scholars to be able to find things wrong in our current Bibles. It’s literature, and therefore completely up to interpretation. Interpretations change because morals and beliefs inevitably change with time. We get all different denominations because of differing interpretations. According to Fredrick Douglass, the cruelest slave owners in pre-Civil War America were the religious ones because they could interpret the Bible in way that they could use it as a justification for savagely beating, starving, and murdering their slaves. Religion HAS to change with society, even if we don't notice it. Ayumi, who are you talking to? |
| Posted by: Sebastian Kafka Sep 18 2003, 02:31 AM |
| Shes talking to me and you Gregor, ahh alas I am indeed not happy, but I feel it has more to do with being bipolar (manic depression) then the lack of go din my life, apart from that I'm ok, I start uni soon, I have a brilliant girlfriend I love and is currently pregnant with my children, what more could I ask for And the bible is a great book don't get me wrong, it gives a moral code to live your life by, but it won't be the same as it was originally written, its like chinese whispers but over thousands and thousands of years.... millions even as is that case. And Ayumi, I don't think anyone can say they are truely completely happy and content in their life, even if it is filled with a deep faith such as yours. EDIT: ohh another thing do you belive in the truth of the parts of the bible that were taken out by scholars in the medievil times? the whole Lilith, Apocryphes sections, and Mary Magdalen's parts. They were removed during the male dominated past, another example of how society affected the bibles interpretation and translation. The contents of the bible were chosen by a group of clerics who thought that this combination would be useful... Why else would they have left out the fact that Adam's first wife was Lilith and the St. Peter evangelion. |
| Posted by: GregorSamsa Sep 18 2003, 06:25 AM |
| Aww, I was hoping she wasn't talking to me. I'm not an atheist, nor a Christian, nor anything. I'm only seventeen and this world is packed full of things that I want to consider before forming my own concrete belief system. If there is a God or some big, all-powerful creator then I have faith that He or She or, er, It is allowing me to go down a path fit for me. I'm an "everything happens for a reason" type person. Hopefully I have a long time left in the world to learn and observe and have all my questions answered. I'm inclined to believe in God and I do try to keep a spirituality and connection there. I'm restless at the moment in my questioning but I'm confident this is all just part of a life journey, as cheesy as that sounds. |
| Posted by: Phoenix Fire McDaniel Sep 18 2003, 03:59 PM |
| hi... i hope its not too late to join in... im a 14 year old girl from Singapore. Call me Phoe or Phoenix ( my ID's Phoenix Fire Mcdaniel) Sorry but im not allowed to give out my real name.... Im a gryffindor and a christian at that. Hope u guys can welcome me here |
| Posted by: Kai Porter Sep 18 2003, 11:00 PM |
| Welcome to Phoenix sorry, you caught us in a debate. To Geogie, I'm thirteen, and I know what the truth is, and I'm willing to fight for it. It doesn't matter how old you are. And George, procrastination is not a way to find what you want. It's the devil's way of holding you back from what you need. To Sebastion: Look, I know all about Manic Depressives, ok. I'm really not supposed to spout about it, but my aunt is one, and she puts us all through a lot of grief with it, and she's currently in Luisiana jail right now. But I still love her. And, to a non christian, this sounds gay, but I love you too. As a christian, we are to love all people, all sinners, all nations, everybody. That's why hearing you deny yourself hurts me so much....You could ask for eternal life, you know. I can't dictate your actions, but well...I don't think it's right. How old are you? How old is she? and I'm guessing you're not married. |
| Posted by: Ayumi Sep 18 2003, 11:05 PM |
| I'm 13 too and I know exactly what I believe in and I believe strongly in it. I believe every word in the bible.Mabe you should pick one up and read it.And mabe you'll understand what we're(me and kai) are trying to save you from(and i mean eternity in Hell).And Sebastian would you want your future child going to Hell because you didn't believe and neither does your girlfriend.Do you want to live with that pain.Or what if the Rapture happened in a few yrs and you and your wife died and your child was left behind because of and they don't know what happened....would you want to live with that guilt? Gregor then what do you believe in? Do you TRULY believe that there is a G-d out there who sent his only son who died for you on the cross? Only say yes if you TRULY believe it. We will probally live to see the rapture.Times running out. And you WON'T enjoy Hell, I read what you said in the chat. Do you know who runs it???? Satan and right now your making him very happy,and guess what he's gonna try to push you even MORE away from G-d,so he will see you in Hell. Remeber he's the worlds biggest deciever! His time is running out and he's gonna want to take every one he can.You have been warned. |
| Posted by: GregorSamsa Sep 19 2003, 01:13 AM |
| Kai, Ayumi...you're jumping to conclusions! Egads, I'm trying not to get frustrated, but I get the feeling you're not willing to listen to me. All I did was criticize the way the Bible has been passed down and I get told I'm hell bound. Kai, I assume you're talking to me when you say George. I'm not floating around religion-less, waiting for someone to give me a reason to believe in something. I was raised to his point without a religion, and so I built my own beliefs. I have my reasons to believe in God and I have my own belief system that I made by learning about all different religions and learning from my life experiences, but I say it's not concrete because there is more to this world then what I've seen so far, and so I'm open to change. I believe we were put on this earth to learn lessons and gain knowledge - you're saying the devil is the cause of me wanting to learn? What do you mean by procrastination? What am I putting off? Ayumi, I have read the Bible. I believe what I believe strongly as well. I believe in openness, goodwill, morality, and devotion and I follow these guidelines for life. So, why am I going to hell? Yes, I believe in God, but I also understand why other people do not. Hopefully you're not talking to me with the "I will enjoy hell" thing because I've never even been in the chat before, so I didn't say that. I don't label myself a Christian, but that doesn't mean I don't accept Christianity into what I believe. Please try to understand what I’m saying and not preach your beliefs to me. |
| Posted by: AJ Archer Sep 19 2003, 01:39 AM |
| AJ has been listening for a while and finally gets annoyed. She pushes the door open and stalks in. "You know, for being a religious club, this sounds more like a debate. Doesn't your-" She points at Kai and Rachel, "religion advocate peace and love? Not to say I know, 'cause I don't, I'd rather swallow glass shards than go to a Christian church, but it seems more like you're spreading discord than anything! Why do we need a churchy club anyway?" |
| Posted by: Rachel Ferguson Sep 19 2003, 01:43 AM |
| Rache sighed a little at the excitable duo. "Gregor, sorry if you are slightly overcome, they are just lookin out for your soul heehee, but maybe not quite in the most rational way. Everything they have said is true, and no one knows how much time is left. You most definately have the right to whatever choice you want, and shouldn't be pressured into anything. Think about what you want, what you believe, and what's out there. We wish your choice to be with Jesus and God, but its yours alone. It seems to me that you are an agnostic; not really sure about God but not sure He's not real either. That's very common among teenagers not brought up in the church; we're still kids we don't know what to believe. Hopefully in this club you can learn a little more about Christianity, and help your decision. Yes, we will love you no matter what your choice, just as the Bible says to love our enemies (which is the hardest thing to do) and that others will know we are christians by our love. " She smiled warmly at the new member. "Oh, and Phoenix, welcome to the club. We LOVE new people, and feel free to express yourself in any way you like, but make sure to respect the beliefs of everyone else also. Thanks so much for joining us, and here, have a wheat thin!" |
| Posted by: Kai Porter Sep 19 2003, 02:40 AM |
| Ok, Here I go again! Gregor (sorry about callin' you george, I was in a hurry): I don't mean to sound preachy, because that's probably the last thing ever possible to be, just because of a few laws in the bible, but I do feel inclined to share the truth, which is also in the bible. I didn't mean to push THAT message across (though if you haven't accepted Jesus, it's true) but I believe with all my heart and soul that God protects his word. I'm considering studying hebrew, greek and aramic, just so I can translate it for myself, and prove a point. You do realise that it's in all three languages, because jesus spoke Aramic, and half the priests wrote in greek not hebrew. AJ: Christians do love. But, let me tell you, love isn't always hugs and kisses and praise. True love involves disipline, and forgiveness, and sometimes arguements and confrontations. A true friend tells you when you've done something bad, because they love you. And, discord is spread through the differences in our beliefs, because, just like in most arguments, no one wants to admit they're in the wrong, and because in most cases only one is right. I've seen some really pointless and dorky clubs here, and this is one with a point. You don't have to come, and you don't have to read our name or our posts, so if you would rather swallow glass, go ahead cause you just entered my worship space.l |
| Posted by: GregorSamsa Sep 19 2003, 02:59 AM |
| Phew, ok. Wasn't it me who complained about how a religious club would start fights? Oh boy. See, I get so sick of people telling me I'm going to hell because I don't go to church on Sundays, I just get a little crazy. I'm going to take a deep breath and walk away now. Sorry guys. I'll save the Bible talks for my history teacher. |
| Posted by: Sebastian Kafka Sep 19 2003, 04:25 AM |
| ohh another thing do you belive in the truth of the parts of the bible that were taken out by scholars in the medievil times? the whole Lilith, Apocryphes sections, and Mary Magdalen's parts. They were removed during the male dominated past, another example of how society affected the bibles interpretation and translation. The contents of the bible were chosen by a group of clerics who thought that this combination would be useful... Why else would they have left out the fact that Adam's first wife was Lilith and the St. Peter evangelion. Sorry to repeat this but I'm genuinely interested to your beliefs. Firstly Kai I'm 'S-E-B-A-S-T-I-A-N' noy Sebastion, Sebasten, sebaston, or any other variation. and no I am not married, me and my girlfriend are both 18, we are both starting university in a few weeks and she is pregnant with twins. If your aunt is bipolar can I enquire if she belives in God as strongly as you do? Ayumi, umm I know this is slightly off topic but why do you never write God, as God, why do you write it as G-d and L-rd? "And Sebastian would you want your future child going to Hell because you didn't believe and neither does your girlfriend." Um I'll all up for debating nicely and such, thats why I asked you about the sections of the bible taken out as I enquired above, but I don't think that comment was necessary Ayumi. No my girlfriend doens't bleive in an all powerful diety either, shes more of an athiest then me. But if I remeber from when I read the bible (I don't like to disbelive in things I haven't read and researched thoroughly) isn't there a part that says 'thou shalt not condem' me and my girlfriend and our unborn children are as good as being condemed by you. I don't appreachiate the insinuation that we don't love our children enough to save them from a suposed evil fate. I lik ehaving religios debates and I respect everyones rights here to their beliefs, but I find it quite insulting that your preying for me as you believe my soul is lost, then ignoring the real theological questions I ask, such as the one at the start of this post which I have asked before. |
| Posted by: McGonagall Sep 19 2003, 04:30 AM |
| STUDENTS! BOTH IC AND OOC! Let's get this straight. This is Virtual Hogwarts. NOT A CHURCH! This site;s main focus is mainly on Harry Potter. I don't see HOW this has to do with it, but since it is approved.. I have gotten compliants, I DO NOT APPROVE OF THIS BEHAVIOR. I don't want ANY "you are going to hell" business. foolish. I will not have any of you tell another that. I WILL NOT HAVE YOU ATTACK PEOPLE OOC OF THEIR RELIGION. This is VH! put it in your puny minds. You all as Christians say you are here with kindness and such... but WHY start a debate? You leave people of their opinions. If you get sneers. including mine, either openly or secretly, get over it. You made this club when I don't think it has much to do with a harry Potter environment. So, religion might play a part in the world.. but do you actually think we need to being in real life controversies in our supposedly PEACEFUL environment. I wish to take points, but I am not sure whether it is in my place to do so since hagrid did approve of this club.. I would take points because all of you yourselves have acted in a childish, foolish, close-minded behavoir. But I advise you to be more respectful of others. I hear one more nonsense, spiteful comment.. and I'll meet you outside of VH because I know that you are telling me I'm going to Hell as well with my beliefs. You stay out of Sebastian's business..his beliefs and his family is none of your business. let me tell you.. You swallow glass since it was you who brought something non-Harry Potter into OUR environment. |
| Posted by: Random Sep 19 2003, 04:36 AM |
| (In an online religious debate, everyone is a loser) |
| Posted by: Rachel Ferguson Sep 19 2003, 02:06 PM | ||
| Rachel sat down and looked at what her club had become. Her worst fears, what she had tried and tried to prevent, were coming real once again. She shook her head and stood up. "Excuse me, everyone? The time has come. As Proffessor McGonagall said, there will be NO more arguing, no more fighting, and no more condemnation. We are going back to the original running of the club, where you post about the religion you are/wish to believe in, and do not comment on what others wish to do in their lives. It is no ones place to do that. *sigh*. So, at the top of your posts please write what religion, post what you wish about how it has affected your life or something you learned, and leave the debates out. Religious debates have gone on since the beginning of time, and will never be solved. You can't make someone believe what you want them to just by "scaring" them into it. PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE if you feel for some reason you can't partcipate without commenting negatively on someone else's opinion no longer post in this club. If this goes on I will request closure of the club to Proffessor McGonagall. Respect is the most important part of a club with such different views, and something that all club members should possess if they wish to get anything out of a club such as this." She sat down and put her head in her hands, refusing to look at anyone. A post I made back in August tht expresses these same things, maybe will help you see what the original goal of FCMPwas...
|
| Posted by: Apollo Phoebus Sep 19 2003, 07:52 PM |
| "WoW I guess that i shouldnt even try to understand what is going on right now! I know that everybody is fighting and this is deffinetly what this club is for. I hope that we can all start to get along and grow with God!" |
| Posted by: Iker Sorderstorm Sep 19 2003, 08:47 PM |
| "is there room for a catholic boy?" |
| Posted by: Kai Porter Sep 20 2003, 12:55 AM |
| Ok, firstly I wish to apologize. Not for insulting anybody with my beliefs, because I am proud of them, and if you took offense, I'm sorry that that's the way you think. I apologize for ruining a perfectly good club by starting a debate. Sebastian, sadly I do not know what she believes because the last time I saw her, was before I really knew about any of this. Before I was saved. I don't know about the books you speak of, I've never heard of them, and so I've never read them. I'm sure they speak truth, but I can't swear. Mcgonnagal: it's not the sneers that bother me. I get those all the time. It's that the people behind the sneers really don't know the truth. I'm folding up my debate now, and will take my light to another site. I will not however, stop posting at this club, nor will I hide my beliefs behind an Internet character. I am proud of them. Well, Iker, of course there's room. The more the merrier. And I'm a babtist. A common steryotype is that Baptists like to argue, and sometimes it's true. Fair Warning. |
| Posted by: Ayumi Sep 20 2003, 01:37 AM |
| Sebastian,sorry if I offened you in any way, that was not my intention,but if you took it as a insult then I am truly sorry and hope that you can forgive me. Proffessor I'm not telling anyone that they are going to Hell.I'm just saying that is a consicqunce.Also as a believer it is my duty to tell people who have strayed or not known christ about our wonderful Lord.I'm not forcing anyone to believe a word I say,since it is up to them to believe or not. I don't see any anger proffessor.It is all up to a person to uphold peace or let anger out. Religion is peaceful.Who cares what type of site this is,I will still tell people the good news in any site!!! I don't care if you don't like me telling people the truth,because your not gonna stop me.I am proud of my religion.I would still tell people my beliefs even if the held a gun to my head and were even about to pull the trigger!! I'd tell them yes, I am a believer,and if they kill me at least i would die standing up for what i believe in!!! By the way i'm not acting closed minded. Closed minded means that you are not listening to anyone elses's say, and I am reading and listening to what they say. I may be only 13, but I'm not stupid,and neither is Kai!! And if you don't want me telling people about G-d and i know they're not a believer do you want me living with that guilt?? It seems as that you do. I would never go up to someone and say you are going to Hell, for one you don't even know me,and you are making unfair judgments about me and Kai. Like I said before I'm proud of my faith and I don't care what you think about me!! |
| Posted by: Sebastian Kafka Sep 20 2003, 02:21 AM |
| Kai, Ayumi, no one is saying your not allowed to be proud of your faith, I just don't appreachiate being told I'm going to eternal damnation for not agreeing with you. I like to debate theological ideas, thats why I asked about the parts of the bible that were taken out by scholars in the medievil times the whole Lilith, Apocryphes sections, and Mary Magdalen's parts. They were removed during the male dominated past, another example of how society affected the bibles interpretation and translation. The contents of the bible were chosen by a group of clerics who thought that this combination would be useful... Why else would they have left out the fact that Adam's first wife was Lilith and the St. Peter evangelion. I'm genurinely curious into your thoughts on this subject as its part of my degree that I'm about to start. Your not being closed minded but your are pretty strong in imposing your opinions upon people, I know that you believe that if you don't your feel guilty but it isn't your place to try and 'save' anyone, christianity, messianic jew, whatever the religion there are hundred of other religions, no one can know if there if a god which religion he belives and advocates. Just try to calm down on the preaching alittle bit ok |
| Posted by: Ayumi Sep 20 2003, 02:34 AM |
| What are you going to be studing in the univerisity? I'm realy glad that you are intrested. We weren't exactly saying that you were going to enternal damnation,we were just saying that would be a consiquence. But it is our place to wittness to people.It even states that in the New Testiment,we're just acting upon what the bible tells us |
| Posted by: Kai Porter Sep 20 2003, 02:36 AM |
| *Throws up hands* That's NOT the impression I was trying to give. I just...well ok it was. Yes, that's what I believe, and I'm sorry you don't. I again don't purposely offend people. And I don't know about those parts of the bible. I wouldn't mind reading them, but prehaps they are not important, or prehaps God spoke and had a hand in their removal, because it is obvious he did not stop it. I don't mean to preach on and on, S, but actually, it IS in the Bible that we are to be fishers of men, a light to the world, and share the truth. We're VERY unpopular on Shockwave because we tend to ask people about their faith. You'd be surprised how many people tell you rather rude things that I won't repeat....(one hint, involves an 'f') |
| Posted by: Ayumi Sep 20 2003, 02:39 AM |
| Yeah,if the saw us in person they would flip us off for sure.And a lot of people have done that to me and my friends from my snyagogue,but people have said more offenceing things than that. |
| Posted by: Kai Porter Sep 20 2003, 02:41 AM |
| "Gimmie five, ya Truth Tellin' Fisher!" Kai high fived with Ayumi, thrilled at the success that they had had on ppl at Ink Link. Even if the failures out weighed the victories in numbers, for every yes, they could take a million nos. |
| Posted by: Ayumi Sep 20 2003, 02:44 AM |
| But even one victory feels like one thousand. And the feeling it leaves afterwards feels simply wonderful*Ayumi smiled at the thought of the feeling.Then she snapped back to reality and gave Kai a high five* |
| Posted by: Kai Porter Sep 20 2003, 02:47 AM |
| Kai smiled for the first time since the debate started, feeling victorious. He pulled out his bible happily and began to drink in the word. God is Good. |
| Posted by: Ayumi Sep 20 2003, 02:49 AM |
| Yeah,and he has proven that to me so many times.The feeling can't be beat |
| Posted by: Kai Porter Sep 20 2003, 02:52 AM |
| Dont I know it. *clasps hands, raises them in praise* And one day we'll be able to praise him at his throne, doesn't that beat all? I can't wait untill I die, and get to lay at his feet to worship Him. Either that or the Rapture. Soon, I hope. So soon. |
| Posted by: Ayumi Sep 20 2003, 02:55 AM |
| I know I look forward to that day that i will see my L-rds face. Don't worry the end days are coming |
| Posted by: Kai Porter Sep 20 2003, 02:57 AM |
| Kai grinned even wider. "I don't think of them as the end. They are the begining. I mean, this is as bad as it gets for us, isn't it..." |
| Posted by: Ayumi Sep 20 2003, 02:59 AM |
| Yeah,it would be a new and wonderful begginning.The thought of it makes me wish it would happen right this instant.Then life would be perfect.No need to worry about someone kiddnapping,murdering,or raping you. |
| Posted by: Kai Porter Sep 20 2003, 03:02 AM |
| None of that worries me anyway. Sure, it's horrible, but you know, God would be with me the whole time, and I have permission to use him as my shoulder to lean on. He'll keep me strong. We better quit posting this stuff here, though. We'll make somebody sick. We need to give S time to reply. |
| Posted by: Ayumi Sep 20 2003, 03:05 AM |
| *Ayumi giggled sightly,and let out one of her best smiles.She hadn't realy smiled all day and that wasn't liek her* Yeah, your probally right.Meet you at the Three Broomsticks?*She asked walking to the door. "A butterbeer will do us some good." |
| Posted by: Kai Porter Sep 20 2003, 03:33 AM |
| "Count on it." he looked over his shoulder at the club that he loved, "I'll be back sebastian. I'm not out of things to say...." He left humming to the quick tune of "coloured people" a christian song by DC talk. |
| Posted by: Sebastian Kafka Sep 20 2003, 03:54 AM |
| I'm studying Astrophysics and philosphy at university Ayumi. umm cough "We weren't exactly saying that you were going to enternal damnation,we were just saying that would be a consiquence." Well saying its a consequence is kind of the same as saying I'll go to eternal hell Ayumi Um and Kai have you stopped writing my name in full as I got annoyed when you spelt it wrong? hehe its really not that hard you know.....Um just wondering, you want to die so you can worship God in person? but if he is incorporeal your never be able to see him, also if he is omnipresent can't you just worship in his presence now? and can we get back to the debating...all this scary fundentalist 'praise the lord' is giving me a headache. I'm not trying to start an argument but I was wondering why your not well, don't doubt God's love when ther is so much suffering an hatred in this world, when there is so much wrong in it, if |God is all powerful and all loving, doesn't that hypocrisy bother you at all? |
| Posted by: Ayumi Sep 20 2003, 04:02 AM |
| Well if we didn't have the bad stuff in life we couldn't appreciate the good.We would take all those momuents that are wonderful for granted. But remember no matter what we do he still loves us.So thats not being a hypocrit(well in my opinoin).But remeber who is loose in the world.I don't think G-ds doing it,its satan who is causing the trouble in the earth,but soon he will be locked away for ever and so will his demons that are causing murders and such. |
| Posted by: Sebastian Kafka Sep 20 2003, 04:14 AM | ||
Surely a world in which there is no bad stuff (despite then not being able to know what is good) is better then the horros that occur in the world? He loves us whatever we do? Now I have met quite a few people in my life I don't like. I don't use the word hate very often as it is in reality an extremely strong and sincere emotion. But I do hate some people. So these people I hate who raped me, beat me, tortured me mentally and physically, God loves them does he? he'd welcome them into heaven if they belive Jesus was his son? well frankly it doens't sound like the best entrance criteria for me. If God is onipotnet (all powerful) why can evil demons roam free in this world to cause the deaths and such as you see it? surely if he is all loving and all powerful he would rid the world of these 'demons' or make it so they have no power? |
| Posted by: Occidit Sep 20 2003, 05:42 AM |
| *Occidit strolled down the halls of the castle, with the intent of investigating all the clamor coming from the Student Clubs Corridor. Before leaving the dormitories he removed his <<Religious Paraphenalia>> and grabbed two books from the desk. Occidit cantered into the dimly-lit room. He was glad the light had been taken elsewhere. Placing two books on the table he sat down, laying one leg over the other and leaning back in the chair. "Norton, Occidit Norton," he explained, as he non-chalantly scanned the room and noticed the inquisitive glances. "These," he began, pointing at the books he laid on the table "are Paradise Lost, by John Milton and Dante's Inferno. You might want to read them since you seem so enamored by the concept of 'hell'. Speaking of which, doesn't it say in your bible that your god alone reserves the right for condemnation? No one, not even your pope has that right. As for you suggesting the consequences of the actions of others, let he who is without 'sin' cast the first proverbial stone." |
| Posted by: lellybelly Sep 20 2003, 06:50 AM |
| Lelly not really a joiner, had hung around outside the door for awhile listening in on the debate. When Occidit made his grand entrance, Lels could sit idily by no longer. After he spoke she walked in and pointedly asked a question ignoring the looks of the others in the room. "Surely you are trying for a bit of irony when you refer to their Bible and then actually end with Biblical Scripture?" taking a seat she nodded to the rest of the room before addressing Occidit again, "And you know, that not all Christians consider the Pope to be an authortative source on Godliness. And even those that do, realize he being human and not divine, that he is unable to damn anyone to hell or eternal damnation." Lelly looked up and apologized quickly, "Sorry, I'm Lellybelly Froglegs, and I happen to have a few questions of faith. Didn't mean to interupt or anything." she offered a smile to the group. (ooc: sorry, M Div student here, couldn't resist the possible theological debate) |
| Posted by: Occidit Sep 20 2003, 08:21 AM |
| *Occidit smiles at the girl that addressed him. "Irony seemed an appropriate literary device for a thread whose title is a oxymoron. ((A two word paradox, ladies and gents, no need to get insulted.))" he began. "I used possesive adjectives rather than a definite article because I do not wish to lend credence to those in question. I respect all religions, and recognize that to some extent they all contain pieces of the greater truth, but do not believe that any one religion has all the answers. Actually, I resent being told that there is one and only one way. I was raised Roman Catholic, and grew to resent some of the blatant hypocrisies propagated by said religion. I do not bare a grudge against any belief system nor organized religion, only blind faith. There can be no faith without reason, nor reason without faith. You can not support a religious argument with a book and what you were taught as a child. You may believe that faith alone is enough for salvation; but faith alone is not enough to win an argument. I'm trying to keep this civil, but fear I shall fail miserably before long. The bible is a collection of secondary sources about the life of Jesus of Nazareth, collected as an ancient scribe saw fit. Never once did a member of your trinity command that the gospels be written. In fact, of Mathew Mark Luke and John, the one written closest to his birth was transcribed some 60 years after his death. For this reason, the book has been mistranslated, and had content added and removed. Even if you learn the languages (and dialect, but this isn't a linguistics conversation) the text was written in, there is no guaruntee that you will glean any new information. The original texts are not publicly available, nor is it likely that you will find an unaltered version in the language of your choice. There are literlly dozens of gospels that weren't included in the universally-recognized Bible. You will have to decide the reasons for that on your own. Those scribes are no different than modern priests. They are not infallible, nor always your god's servants. If you believe differently, then it must be the will of your god to have sex with childeren. No sane nor logical person would agree with my previous statement, so it is foolish to believe that the ancient monks received a divine gift of perception and interpretation while writing the text. In today's world, the Jesus of History and the Christ of Faith have been seperated. It is impossible to understand one without the other. You need to understand the basis of your religion before you take up where the apostles left off and seek to "save" everyone. I'll let everyone in on a little secret. I do not need to be saved. I live my life as I see fit, and walk my own path. I do not need to be told how to live my life by someone whose faith came out of a teacher's manual. Doing good deeds and being genuinely pure is pointless if the only reason for your actions is because you were told to. Good acts done of your own voiltion and free will are much more meanignful. I help others because I chose to. I have my own morals, and my own conscience. I don't need to be told what is right and wrong." |
| Posted by: Kai Porter Sep 20 2003, 02:45 PM | ||||||
| Ok, I'm behind. I'm a Baptist, I think only Catholics have popes...(I'm not sure though) And yeah, that was a good quote. And it's true. But how can you ignore sin that's all around you? I know all about my sin, and I know sins are all equal in the eyes of th e lord. I mean, if you had two guys, and each was perfect except for one sin (say one was a murderer and one told a little white lie) God would condemn them both. If one sought forgiveness (say the murderer) and the other did not (the liar) then the one would be forgiven and the other not. Sebastian, Of course I can worship the Lord now. But when I die, I will go to heaven, and sit at the foot of his throne, and worship him there, in a place where no distractions can creep in, and distract me. I will sit at a feasting table, next to the profits of old, and we will speak together, and praise our lord. Oneday all these debates will be pointless specks of dust.
The Demons exist because God allows them to. It is all written, hundreds of years before it will happen. Eventually, the demons will consume most of the earth, then they will perish in eternal damnation. God wins in the end. If he wanted to, he could win now. But, in his mercy he does not. He is giving the world time. Time, still, after hundreds of thousands of years, to choose him. Because in the end, that's all it will be. You can't serve two masters, after all.
Well Sebastian, you asked about demons, and that answered your own question. There is pain in the world because there is sin. It started in the Garden of Eden, and it spread throughought the world. Think about it. Don't blame god for your troubles. Sin is what is to blame. and to Occidit
How else were they gonna let us start the club, on a Harry Potter site, I'd like ta know. |
| Posted by: Ayumi Sep 20 2003, 03:42 PM |
| Sebastian,those people who did that to you will get theres by G-d.He won't let them go unpunished for what they did to you.They could still go to heaven if they repent from their HEART,and truly believe what they did was wrong,and want G-d to forgive them Remeber like i said,satan is loose in this world,but he knows his time is runnning out,and he wants to take as many of us with him as he can.He will get rid of them when the times is right, which isn't now. I'm just quoting this verse for the heck of it,since it is my FAVORITE one. Matthew 5:3-10 How blessed are the poor in spirit for the kingdom of heave is theirs How blessed are those who mourn for they will be comforted How blessed are the meek for they will ingerit the land How blessed are those who hunger and thirst for righteounsness for they will be filled How blessed are those who show mercy for they will be shown mercy How blessed are the pure in heart for they will see G-d How blessed are those who make peace for they will be called sons of G-d How blessed are those who are persecuted because they pursue righteuosness for the Kingdom of Heaven is theirs! I love this verse,i find it comforting for some reason. |
| Posted by: Sebastian Kafka Sep 20 2003, 04:36 PM |
| I would just like to applaud what Occidit wrote. I don't think I shall be participating in this club further, I do belive it should be in the off topic section, well to be honest apart from the odd occasion time to time there is no RPing happening here. Kai they would have let you start the club in the off topic section of the site, but I don't see why you feel it is an esscentual (gah damned dyslexia what the hall does that actually say?) addition to the site. This is a roleplaying site, not a christian plae of praise. You also mentioned God is not to blame for the worlds problems but sin is. You're not listening to what I have asked about in previous posts. Why does sin exist? why does god permit it in us. He has the power to stop it, surely a world without sin, even if then we don't truely know what 'good' is (although I would be hard pushed to identify pure goodness in this world) is better then a world of suffering. You also mention alot about serving God, and not being able to serve two masters with God and satan. But frankly I don't want to serve either of them if they exist; I am an embittered atheist (the sort of atheist who does not so much disbelieve in God as personally dislike Him). I am my own man, I do not live to serve anyone or anything. I exist meerly to exist. (if I exist at all...but thats a deeper philosophical debate.) All sin is equalin the eyes of the lord? well to be honest I'd much rather lie, "My bus was late, i didn't oversleep" then murder someone. The criminal justice system has a hell of a long way to go and if full of misjudgements and problems but at the moment on the theory of the treatment of the levels of a sin, its beating God by millions of miles. As you have preyed for my soul to find salvation as you say so I do not go to your eternal damnation, I shall hope that you have the curage to think freely for yourselves someday, not regurgitating spoon fed religion from cradle to grave. I'm not implying that you shouldn't have a religion, I think it is wonderful that people have a faith in something good, but its no kind of life or faith if you believe it blindly. Sebastian Kafka signing off. |
| Posted by: Selene_Pendragon Sep 20 2003, 07:02 PM |
| Selene walked into the room once again. She became confused at their conversations. "Um...does someone want to fill me in on what the topic is right now?" ((Seriously, I have no idea what we're talking about. I sure missed alot in the little time I've been gone! And lazy little me here doesn't want to read 20 pages!)) ((Oh Oh! Prayer request please! Tonight is our Homecoming dance and I have a date! YES! However, his ex girlfriend might be going tonight and he was supposed to take her to the dance! But he lied and said he couldn't go at all just so he would go with me! So I'm just afraid of getting attacked by some random stranger! I really want this night to go smoothly!)) |
| Posted by: Apollo Phoebus Sep 20 2003, 07:04 PM |
| "I have a question for Ayumi and Kai!" "Why do you want the world to end so much?" "I know it will be great when we get to see God, but I believe that so many more things need to happen before the world can end!" |
| Posted by: Occidit Sep 20 2003, 07:42 PM |
| ((OOC, nonRP Well, Kai, therein lies the problem. I [personally] do not believe you should have been allowed to start this club. The administration and I differ on this matter, so it is your right to continue. I could easily write an entire post on the reasons for this, but to be perfectly honest, this is only mildly offensive, and not yet worth that expenditure of time.)) *Occidit turns to the boy and surveys him appraisingly. "However, I would be perfectly happy to debate the finer points of your religion, if you wish to keep an open mind." he concluded ((, having spent 12+ years in christian education)) |
| Posted by: Kai Porter Sep 20 2003, 07:51 PM |
| I don't nesessarily want the world to end, I just know it will, and I look forward to the day that Jesus comes for his people, I long for it, and I pray, because...I just do. I guess. The bible says that's good, so I'm not weird I suppose. I just know he's coming and want to be ready. He could come now...or now....or now...or now...or a zillion years into the future, although I believe it'll be soon, becuase they've already got building materials in place for the temple that is predicted to be rebuilt directly after the Rapture (or so I've heard). Good luck on your date, Selene. Our homecoming's next week, but I don't have a date yet.... |
| Posted by: Morgan Madding Sep 20 2003, 08:00 PM |
| Club Member request: Morgan Madding Gryffindor first year Well well, Selene, I already said a little prayer for you, if you don't mind that I'm Catholic. (haha that was a joke) We seem to be having some heated debates in here, and I firstly like to comment on the validity of this club at Hogwarts.net Why not? We don't know that there may be a chapel in the castle, even if it has fallen to dissuse, it probably, at one time or another being a castle was a place of religious warfare. We see that the magic world mirrors our own world very closely, and more and more the deeper that we see into it. Poloticians lie, people die, there is hunger and famine and war. Muggle history is full of religious war, so why wouldn't the magical world? It is very naive to think that witches and wizards don't have a faith system (or systems more likely) Personally, I think that Hogwarts, Like any school, has a chapel or two for students to attend when they feel like it. I always get a laugh out of imagining my priest portkeying right on over to the Hogwarst Chapel for sunday mass. (hahah) Anyway, no need to shout, this was originally a fellowship wasn't it? My little Hufflepuff friend Rachel, who did start this club, is sad that we can't all be nice to each other. There have beens some very interesting conversations though...very cool. |
| Posted by: Occidit Sep 20 2003, 08:11 PM |
| ((OOC> Virtual Hogwarts is a Harry Potter roleplaying site. This club, in it's current incarnation, contains very little active Role Playing. Do you really think witches and wizards would be Christian? After years of persecution and hatred at the hands of the religion. I would take it very personally if my ancestors were burnt at the stake, and I was persectuted and stereotyped as a heathen, blashphemer, and servant of "satan"(Which, if memory serves, translate to "one who judges"). The Hogwarts Castle, in the JK Rowling books, was built by the four founders as a place for magical studies. It was not adapted from a muggle castle, and as such is very unlikely to contain relics of medeival society. Unless I'm mistaken, ancient fortresses and keeps did not contain chapels either; room was a bit scarce with 60+ armored warriors crammed into a main hall, awaiting a rival lord to attack. <OOC) |
| Posted by: Rachel Ferguson Sep 20 2003, 09:10 PM |
| For awhile Rachel sat back and listened to the deep and extremely intellegent conversations going on in the club by those so much more knowledgable than she. She bit her lip and those who chose to criticize, knowing they were entitled to their own opinions. (ooc: actually, Occidit--I started the club, not Kai, so if you want to blame someone make it me. Yes, I know that magic and christianity dont commonly go together, but since this site is based purely on our own personal imagination and interpretation of JK Rowlings world I have in my mind the ideal, though naive, that somehow the magical and Christian boundarys would dissolve in coming to Hogwarts. Since we're not actually going there/here, I don't really see why its such a problem.... )Thank you all for sharing your thoughts and prayers, mine are with all of you as you go about your everyday lives. |
| Posted by: Apollo Phoebus Sep 20 2003, 09:55 PM |
| "AMEN! Rachel, Thank you so very much!" "I believe that people that burned witches at the stack were very ignorant. They did not know for sure if the people "worked for satan". It was a guess of their's. Even though it was wrong I think that in our day nad age people would look at it a lot differently.!" "Also i wanted your guys's opinion on a dream I had last night. "It was of me. my mother, and my sister!" "Too make a long story short my mom and my sister got possessed by the devil and they tried to kill me! And all the people aroud me that were friends and family were all possessed and tried to kill me!" "Hten at the very end all the muslims of the world were celebrating something and all the young males of America (ages 7-10) were getting ready to fight a war!" "Oh and by the way I was never possessed by any demon!" "But I am verey confused about this dream, because I know that Satan doesnt like just because my real name is Christian, but nothing like this has ever happened to me! Now please do not take this as a joke when I woke up I was very scared and didnt know what to do or think and I am asking that you guys/girls could help me with this!??!!?!?Please!" |
| Posted by: Ayumi Sep 20 2003, 10:04 PM |
| Wow,that must have been a scary dream.I've had one sort of like that,but its a long story I'll tell ya later.Well,are the rest of your family strong beliver(probally since you are)? Wait till Kai gets on he's good at inturrpting dreams. |
| Posted by: Occidit Sep 20 2003, 10:07 PM |
| ((OOC> I have no problem with a theology or philosophy club, nor any real problem with this one. I am aware that Kai didn't start the club, and I apologize if it sounded otherwise. My problems with this club, and with the comments Kai has made are three-fold. 1) Close-minded righteousness. I have no problem with those whose beliefs are steadfast, but preaching annoys the "hell" out of me. I have no problem with sharing views, beliefs and faith stories. It's probably quite healthy. But being told that I'm going to burn in hell by someone who knows less about their religion than I do is laughable. I was actually quite happy when this club strayed from the Christian title. I can envision a religion or philosophy club at Hogwarts, and think the later is quite probable. Having a club for only one group of people just irks me. What if I started a "White" club or an "Irish" club? There is obviously a difference, in that you can not change your heritage, but I see the two issues as linked. 2) OOC. This is going to come off as a bit harsh, but: A club about your real life faith has no place here. A club where you Roleplay theological discussions or sharing of faith *as your character* is fine, and would probably be a great addition to the site, providing depth to the character you are trying to role play, and adding another dimension to the reasons for your actions. I object to "Pray for me as I go to school tomorrow." That is an off-topic discussion, and should take place there. I also think it is dangerous for VH to endorse any one religion or ethnicity. 3) A dangerous precedent. Which brings us to my final point. We've had a Video Game Club, which was shut down for obvious reasons. Everyone was discussing things that couldn't possibly occur at Hogwarts, I see this club falling into the same trap. That has obviously changed in your mission statement, but I don't believe some people have realized this. Some people had a problem with the "American Patriots Club" or something similar that was started in Off Topic. I don't need to reiterate the reason that they took offense, but this is going to run into the same problem. I suggest coming up with a new title, and editing the first post to reflect what this has grown into. Since religion and faith are issues that people feel strongly on, I can see this club becoming an integral part of the lives of some VH characters. I don't mean to naysay, but there are a few flaws that need to be addressed. |
| Posted by: Rachel Ferguson Sep 20 2003, 10:42 PM |
| (ooc: Thank you for your input Occidit, and even more for the very respectful way you phrased it, it means a lot to me and most likely the other members of the club. Since its "founding" the ooc part has always been an issue, and why don't we just say that our character is feeling the same way we are, that way we get the point across without being too branched out? I know I personally relate very closely with Rachel, but also I know that most people make a foil personality or just a different one for use on this site. Hopefully as the club and people in it are more developed in their beliefs the flaws you see will grow fainter. ) Rachel looked over at Apollo, and then thought of what her friend Morgan had said about what she learned in her muggle Philosophy class. "Apollo, it may just be that you feel on your own/chastized about your own faith, and that no one around you seems to be on the "same side" if you will as you are. I see your dream as being purely symbolic, you most likely dont think your loved ones have be possessed do you? Dreams are a very confusing branch of consiousness." She shrugged a little and hugged Apollo. "Don't get too worried, remember it was just a dream after all." |
| Posted by: Occidit Sep 20 2003, 11:14 PM |
| ((OOC> In terms of religious beliefs, it would make sense for your character to share yours. But talking of Youth Groups, Prayer Requests, et aliam was the OOCness that I took issue with. If you wish to share real life faith experiences that must be given in a 'muggle' context, I suggest a companion thread in the Off Topic section. Discussing holy books, religious practices, and faith would make sense amongst the characters. Hell, I think this would be most valulable as a place to come and learn about *other* faiths, something which people of all denominatons should strive for. If you can not find value in other belief systems, and annalyze them objectively, how can you ever do the same for yours? I believe very strongly that religion should be found/chosen rather than inherited. You can't really call yourself a believer until you've tested your faith. I've tested mine, but found out that it wasn't what I believed. It's coming up on four years since I had my first doubts, and two years since I openly walked away from Catholocism, and I'm just now starting to understand what I truely believe. Personally, I could never declare that my way was the one true way without being exposed to other beliefs; I don't think others can either.)) *Occidit stared blankly at Apollo. "That's an... interesting dream," he began hesitantly. "It almost sounds like she was reading about Childeren's Crusade or watching the Excorsist before she went to bed. Maybe you should consult Professor Trelawny?" he suggested. |
| Posted by: Kai Porter Sep 21 2003, 03:56 AM | ||
welll...........Ayumi says I can inturperet, but I'm not that good. I can't really say on this one, but it seems you were having one very similar to me. I had this dream a couple of nights back. My mother, sister, father and I were all in the kitchen. I was standing alone. Suddenly, Satan appeared before me, and took me over. I was shoved into the farthest part of my being, like I was trapped in a bottle. I was kicking and screaming, but my body just stood there and laughed evily. So, in spirit, I got down on my knees and prayed, and the Archangel, Michael, apeared and said, just like in the bible, "The LORD rebuke you, Satan, accuser of men!" and my body cringed. Then Michael went on, but I don't remember what else he said. Satan left my body, but in leaving, he killed my body. I fell to the floor. In spirit, I was falling through to a bright light. The light reached out and caught me, and said something, but all I remember is kinda a "not yet" speach, and I was getting up off the floor. I woke up, and I was flat on my back, numb all over. I think it means, either Satan was having a go at your weak points right then, or he will do so in the near future. I'm gonna ask my Youth Pastor about it tommorow. |
| Posted by: Hagrid Sep 21 2003, 04:20 AM | ||
I feel that at this point I have to defend myself to Occidit...
I posted that more than a month ago, on August 15th. I'd venture to say that the administration of the site doesn't even know that this club exists. In fact, I'm nearly positive that that is correct. There is only one administrator here, and that's Dumbledore. I was also against this club from the beginning, however, as I had previously had a falling out with Professor Faith in regards to my trust of her, I allowed her approval of this club to stand as a token of good faith. In my only previous post a month ago, I made two statements. First, I said that there would be no problem so long as people could get along with one another. Second, I said that the thread needed to remain in character as much as possible for it to remain open. Neither of those things have happened. Therefore, I am revoking Professor Faith's approval of the club. If you wish to continue this in it's current incarnation, move it to the off topic portion of the board. This thread will remain open for a few days just to see what happens. After reading through this thread, I have countless things that I feel an urgent need to say. Unfortunately, as a person in a position of power at the site, I feel that I can not say anything without undermining the authority and respect of the position. However, this is a good lesson for all of you. There are times when it is best not to say anything at all. As argumentative as you are, and regardless of how you feel about a certain topic, certain things are better left alone. The hornet's nest that usually results can cause far more harm than the original discussion. We all believe different things. And we will always believe different things. No matter how hard you try, you won't change that. And that's the existentialist in me speaking right there. -Hagrid |
| Posted by: Kai Porter Sep 21 2003, 04:26 AM |
| Kai gasped. "what!" he was outraged. It was a friendly debate. No one was poking anybody's eye out. "I was looking at the OT section, and I might just go and start one there." He had half a mind to start pmimg people all over the school just so he could see how out numbered he was. |
| Posted by: Jodie Wolf Sep 21 2003, 04:36 AM |
| (OOC: I'm with Hagrid there... It doesn't seem like much of a friendly debate to the outsider's point of view...) |
| Posted by: Occidit Sep 21 2003, 04:39 AM |
| First, the obligatory ((OOC> I have a nasty habit of being picky about semantics, so I'd like to clear one thing up. By my use of "administration," I meant to imply all of those that work hard to keep this site alive and running properly. This is a generous group of people of which you, Hagird, are a member. I was trying to avoid coming off as my usual arogant self, and express my views on the matter. Perhaps my point could have been better made by simply stating "IMO: In My Opinion," but what is done is done. I completely agree with your original statement, and have quite possibly subconsciously paraphrased it. I'm actually sorry to see this club end. (Weird, I know.) I believe that a "Philosophy Club," or something similar could be quite useful and enjoyable, but I was irked by some of the discussion here. Perhaps I should have left many things unsaid, but I felt compelled to add my commentary on an issue I have strong feelings on. (Edit: As someone who has no power or responsibilty, I'd love to hear your views. ) |
| Posted by: Ayumi Sep 21 2003, 05:42 AM |
| You know we have the right to talk about things that truly matter.I don' t care what you think Occit or what ever your name is.People shouldn't be trying to knock this club down, and i'm totally against it!!! You know what this will all matter one day!! The rapture is coming!!!! We are only trying to prepare people and bring them to the L-rd and if you have a problem with that,then your principils are realy screwed up!! |
| Posted by: Genevieve Sep 21 2003, 07:21 AM |
| ((OOC: Okay I agree this has gone too far. Why have a christian group on a wizarding site? To save our souls? Anyways Ayumi why do you say L-rd and G-d not the name? I mean he is the LORD and GOD say his proper name if you believe in him so much) |
| Posted by: Jodie Wolf Sep 21 2003, 07:32 AM |
| (OOC: It's not appropriate for this board... It would do better in the Off-Topic section... I don't even really think it is a club... more of a sort of... Group. But not a club... well, the happy middle then. Anyways, don't have a coniption fit... Wasn't this originally meant to discuss religion?) |
| Posted by: Hagrid Sep 21 2003, 07:36 AM |
| Ayumi, you have the rights that we give to you while you are at this site. You may think this repressive, and it is, but without rules and regulations there would be no site to come to at all. That being said, we have given you a place to talk about The Rapture (I'm sorry if I am in error by capitalizing this. It seemed the sort of thing that you'd capitalize) if you so wish. The off topic section is easily accesible by all persons, and I'd welcome a topic with intelligent talk and debate about things such as religion there. It would do much to revitalize that portion of the board, which never really recovered when we split it off and made a seperate board. The initial aim of this club was not to try and promote one specific religion. Nor was it to attempt and proselytize the members of this website. It was a place for people of all religious persuasions to meet and talk free of all of that. I'm sorry that you found that too difficult a concept to handle. |
| Posted by: Jace Walker Sep 21 2003, 09:05 AM |
| I've said this so many times in the real world: "There is nothing you can do to please everyone." It's sad that we've come to this (BTW- yes, I've got a point being in here; I'm not an athiest). I understand why the creator selected this sect to be Christianity because many people are (not to diss the other religious groups). But the reason why we're arguing here is probably one of the reasons we can't hold spoken prayer in schools, they're thinking of taking "under God" out of the pledge, and so many people are spazing (sorry if that's a poor choice of words) out over the slightest religious things. |
| Posted by: Professor Faith Tiernay Sep 21 2003, 10:04 AM |
| Hmm... Well then... Seeing as this club as gotten quite a bit out of hand and has not become what I had originally hoped it would be, it would be at this point I would normally revoke my former given approval of this club. However, I see that Hagrid has so kindly taken the liberty to do so for me, as well as cutting open old wounds and adding insult to injury! Why, thank you, Hagrid. - Faith. |
| Posted by: Rachel Ferguson Sep 21 2003, 02:11 PM |
| Dear Professors Hagrid and Tiernay, Thank you for your respectful revocation of this club as you see it in the best interests of all the students at Virtual Hogwarts. I apologize for ALL of us (hem hem note--arguing with admin notttt a good idea..) and can only hope that someday we will have the maturity to start a club like this again. To all the "club" members--for those of you that shared without disrespect or criticism, thanks, it's meant a lot to me and I would like to still be in contact with you. my AIM sn is Sweetybc87 if you ever want to talk.. To everyone who chose to post: the different perspectives are what made this club so enriching and thanks so much for sharing how you feel and how you see the world. It helps us grow as people and to more fully understand our fellow hogwarts "students". *wipes away tears* Let's see what happens in the off topic section, shall we? With love for all of you, even those who didn't like me --Rachel |
| Posted by: Ayumi Sep 21 2003, 03:56 PM |
| I write L-rd & G-d, like this because if this by any chance got erased that would mean the L-rd's name has been earsed.And writing it like this doesn't make you believe in him any less! |
| Posted by: Seth Sep 21 2003, 05:20 PM |
| OOC: ^^; Believe it or not, I'm Christian too. I fully believe that we SHOULD be 'spreading the good word', and all that, but a forum is not the place to do so. It's much too impersonal, and you can't talk to someone one on one. Speaking to someone directly is a much better way, in my opinion. It may take longer, but it shows that you can actually care about what happens to one person, instead of the whole large group. Anyway, I find it slightly disappointing that this club was taken down, but I can't say that I don't know why. Religion has always been a source of argument, and this topic has been no exception. This was supposed to be a Christian Fellowship, was it not? Shouldn't then, the goal be to spend time talking with others of the same faith, finding kindred spirits and all that? No arguments should've come up out of that. Anyone who posted in here with 'proof' or whatever against our faith should've known that it would be defended. But this topic wasn't meant to be any competition, it just turned out that way. After all, discussions are for EVERYONE, aren't they? So you can't truly have a Fellowship then. I babbled a bit, I suppose. I guess I just came to say that I'm glad this club was made in the first place... I hadn't known that there were so many people here like me. I wish you guys luck Off Topic. ^^ God Bless. |
| Posted by: Sebastian Kafka Sep 21 2003, 10:01 PM |
| *wipes tear from eye* "farewell ickle religious club, no longer shall I be told I am going to hell " *hands a box of cookies to Faith and blushes* "there there professor." |