Audio Tape Introduction to this meeting by Kenneth Scalf.
This is March 30, 1999. Mr. Jim Shaver will appear before the Stevens County Commissioners to present to them we hope to be the fact that they have allowed the County Auditor to file illegal liens against over 2000 people's property here in Stevens County. This will also be the day tbat our Sheriff, Mr. Craig Thayer is to present something be_ore the Counsel and we hope to get that on this recording as well. Today has been a ordinary stormy, Spring day. We had quite a bit of snow this morning-ifyou can call a half an inch quite a bit which really is not much. Anyway, we hope this will be a very good day for the people of Stevens County. We wish Mr. Jim Shaver well on his presentation. Hopefully we can get a good recording. Ok, I'll back out until we start the proceedings.
Present were: Stevens County Auditor, Tim Gray; Commissioners: Vickie Strong, Chair Fran Besermin and Fred Lotze. Attorney/Sheriff Thayer was invited but didn't come.
|Comm. Fran Besermin:||Ok (Jim), Is everyone here-- (About 30 men and women) with you?|
|Jim:||(Looking around) I believe so|
|Fran:||So you are going to be the prime speaker?|
|Jim:||Yes, for the Steering Committee.|
|Fran:||Then I don't have to divide the time up between other people? Just you?|
|Jim:||I don't think so, unless somebody has something to comment about.|
|Fran:||Ok, Ok, So you want to go ahead and run the meeting, I guess--it's your meeting. Or, it's your presentation, so go ahead.|
|Jim:||Well, we've come across some pretty grave problems, I think, for the county! And it goes back a long way(s). The largest business in the world today makes Microsoft look like a lemonade stand. The largest business in the world today is the pillage and plunder of the American people. And I think I've found the key to that. And it's done by the IRS that has transferred its liability to the County Council (Commissioners)...particularly to the County Auditor and particularly to the Sheriff because it involves a securities fraud...and it isn't being prosecuted. And in this little county of 35,000, is it roughly?|
Here's the Lien list. the Federal Tax Lien list. There's 2000 names or 2000
recordings on that list. And if you look at how that would affect the various
families in the community, you're looking at 15 to 25 per cent of the community.
All on this Lien list--and they are there because of the Securities fraud. Now.
the IRS is extremely powerful. At least, they think they are until the wrath or the
American people comes up. And what they do...they come in with a "Notice" of
Lien, and it's a (IRS FORM) 668 (Y) (Shows example of it included in the packet
given to each Cormnisioner and the Auditor) They use a county statute, ah, not a
County Statute but a State Statute. R.C.W 60 68 that orders the County Auditor
to file the "NOTICE" of Lien in an alphabetical Tax "Lien" Index. It also says that
it requires "Certification ". It's Certification that entitles those Notices to be filed.
Well, back in 93, I had just moved over here then, I wrote "An Open Letter to the Sheriffs
Across America." I gave that to the County Council (Commissioners). The problem is I buried
that in 146 pages of material. I know how very busy you are, so you probably never got to it.
What it does...it exposes how this "Notice" of Lien, being filed in a Lien Index...it boosts the
power of the Lien (Notice), and a man by the name of Errol Mackzum (who) was the
Auditor/Controller/Recorder in the largest county in the United States, which is San Bernardino
County in California...he got a copy of this (OPEN LETTER) about a week after I put it out, and he
was approached by some people that I hadn't met and took it to him and said (asked) "Is this guy
right or not? He said, "Let me study it". Well, they came back to him and he said it was
unconscionable for him to file a mere "Notice" of Lien in a "Lien" Index because it boosted
the "POWER" from a non-negotiable instrument into what is "treated" as a negotiable
instrument...cause once it's in a Lien index...the next day the IRS agent can come in and say
"Give me a Certified Copy of the LIEN index." Then he has proof of a spendable instrument to go out
and pillage and plunder property. But, the fact that it was given more power than it was entitled
to, in the filing...is like taking a four year old child in a journeyman carpenters
[i.e. it's like trying to change a four year old child into a journeyman carpenter by
putting the four-year-old's name into a "Journeyman Carpenter Index"]
..I mean, you
can give him a hammer and stuff, but he's not going to be a journeyman carpenter. So, a Securities
Fraud is created there. And, when they get the Auditor to go do this...it transfers the liability
from the IRS, who says HEE HEE--you "volunteered", over to the Auditor who actually performs the
deed. And, then from that, emanates a "Notice of Levy. It isn't even a Notice of Levy. They take
that and they give it to somebody like Craig Thayer, the Sheriff. Usually the Sheriff or the Police
and say "These people need to have their property seized" and the Sheriff has the duty of going out
and seizing and procuring and setting the property up for auction...which comes a little
later...but, he's working from a Notice. He's working from an unperfected instrument. He's working
from a Securities Fraud.
Now, I took nineteen people down to the United States Securities and Exchange Commission in Seattle. And we went in and, and this is a full floor of the 22nd floor--I think it was... of the 50 story Federal Building. They had a Law Library in there that would make any university envious..especially a town of this size. And I talked with John Badger Smith who was an Attorney for the United States Security and Exchange Commission, and he brought his boss in, Nobi Kawasaki. And we asked them if they had the power to shut Fraud down?
|J B. Smith:||Oh absolutely! (Paraphrased)|
|J B. Smith:||That's what our Agency is all about! (Paraphrased)|
Wonderful ! ! !|
And we laid this out, and we showed how this liability is transferred and they've got the counties committing the fraud-by the filing. And they got real nervous. And we said "Get back to us in 30 days. We want a written response from you in 30 days."
|J B.Smith:||Ok, we'll do that! (Paraphrased)|
Well, in about seven days into the thirty days both newspapers came out with (Headlines) "Giant Sex
Scandal in the USSEC Office In Seattle" and they shut the entire office down and they moved it to
L.A. (California). I just traced John Badger Smith down to Denver, Colorado. and he said "Well, Mr.
Shaver. I'm not so sure that a Lien as the USSEC would define it, is the same definition that would
fit what the IRS is doing/using. (Paraphrased). I said, "Look. It's an evidence of debt, it's
registered, it's numbered and it's used in Commerce to seize and sell property....Because, it goes
after awhile to an Auction. And it's auctioned off. Now, because of the Securities Fraud, involved in
every single person being on ~ (I'm showing the IRS Tax Lien List of 2,000), each and every person on
this list,... 2000 in this county,... have a cause of action against the Auditor, maybe against the
Sheriff, and against the policy makers that set this policy down. Now, I know you're fighting the
State Statute on this, but there's nothing that entitles you to allow a Securities Fraud to be going
on that should be prosecuted. And, and Shut it down. But, each and every name, I want to see taken
off this list. And this is raping, it's just pillaging the people. There are two people on this list
that were on here for over a million dollars (each). Now, that's money that's fleeing the county!!!
If they are all on there for Securities Fraud...now there are certain commercial remedies that
protect the county...Like when the IRS agent comes in...
"O.K. .Mr. IRS agent...In the past you've induced us into a fraud that we won't be a part of any more! Now, first, we'll need your "delegation of authority" from the Secretary of the Treasury of the United States of America to perform an assessment in the first place. Then we want your Affidavit, signed true, correct and complete, under penalties of perjury, that this person owes something. And, whatever the amount might be."
I don't think they're going to be around, because the whole thing is a giant scam, but that's a whole another days subject....But...what the affidavit does, and you get positive I.D. from him, including his home address, in case you have to serve him. ..His business address. You want a fingerprint for positive I.D and maybe a retina (iris) scan, and SHUT THE FRAUD DOWN. And he won't be there, probably. . ..trying to induce you into this (SCAM), if he has to sign an affidavit, true, correct and complete. But, that's what's on the 1040 form...you sign them...true, correct and complete. They want all three. That really is the crux of everything. I've got 15 questions in here that I'd like a written response on to our committee... that maybe Tim can come up with and answer as to how they treat this. But...There is no acceptable substitute for honesty in government! And particularly in something as important as what they (IRS) say is Tax collection. And I'll guarantee you it isn't (Tax Collection). but that again is another day...because they're not collecting taxes for the government of this country.
But, the Notices are filed in this county and they are also filed down in Olympia. And you'll see in there (Commissioners packet of paperwork I gave them) there is no judicial orders, no process documents, no affidavits, with them when they are filed in Olympia.
They ask Tim here, to put a stamp of receipt on it and that's his Seal. And that may just have him breaking the law regarding the law regarding United States Seals, because this (Stevens County) is an appendage of the Federal Govermnent, I would think. And I don't like to see someone like Tim put into a position where he's got a seal on something that is a Fraudulent Security. And, I think it's in violation of both the Seals Laws and the Fraudulent Security (Laws) (Copies of Title 18, Sections 1017 and 513 were included in the Commissioners packet), cause that's what they create. when they (IRS) come in and ask for a certified copy of the Lien Index. I did give, ...well, as an example, ...one time my wife and I were ah, they (IRS) took 100% of our Pensions. The City and the State..the City (Seattle) and the State (Washington State Investment Board/ Department of Retirement Systems/ Law Enforcement Officers ~ Firefighters Pension System) turned it all over to them (IRS) - 100% of it (both of our pensions). It took me about a year and a half and I got it all back with interest...at least my end of it.. when I proved the Scam they (IRS) were pulling. I sent through J.D. (Anderson--a former Stevens County Commissioner that got replaced in the last election by Vickie Strong) ..I gave J.D. a "Solemn Recognition of Mixed War" here in '96. Now what that is, is where the government comes down on a single family. What it is basically is a plea for help. And, it was addressed to the County Commissioners and it was addressed to the Sheriff (Pertinent parts of this were included in the commissioners packet). I never got so much as the courtesy of a "Go to hell! letter", or goodbye or anything. I did get a couple of extra patrol cars around my farm, up there (On Echo mountain). But don't misunderstand it. What this is, is a plea for help to shut down the fraud. And there are a couple of pomons of this (Plea) that are there (in your packet) And I'll overlook the fact that...well it was December 20th of '94' when I came in and talked before. But. Iike I say, I had an awful lot of material. And my letter (Open Letter To The Sheriffs Across America) was buried in 146 pages of material.
So, we're here under the "Misprision of Felony Laws''. right now-- Reporting the Crime... that says if we don't report the crime--then we become ."Accessories to the Crime' So, that's why our Steering Committee is here...in this regard. And we want within 91 days, an answer. We'd like every name on this list pulled. They are there because of the Securities Fraud. Now, the S.E.C. the United States Security and Exchange Commission, their whole Agency should be ABATED... because it's their job to shut this type of thing (Securities Fraud) down. And they are running from it (their responsibility)...cause it's a PIRACY the way it's operated. And the "DIVISION OF THE SPOILS", I would guess in some areas, that..everybody's property that is on this list, is part of the "PRIZE" and "BOOTY".
There is an old saying over in Yugoslavia:
Appeasement is sort of, like, feeding your children to the Alligator, hoping, he'll eat you last!!!
So, anyway, we're here, as your friends. We want to get behind you in any way we can support you. We are...we want to get behind Tim, but we want the fraud shut down!!! And we want the names off this list!!! And, we're asking twenty-one (21) days to be ample time because there is nobody that should be on this list that isn't on there because of the Securities Fraud. Where they take the lien and they get the County Auditor, and what I see is our Commissioners you're only bonded for like $15,000 each. One lawsuit from this (Securities Fraud) Does anyone sue anymore for less tban a million? And what tbis represents, ... thc damage done to people on this list...I know one guy that blew his brains out. I know
|Comm. Fred Lotze:||He must not have had many!|
|Jim:||I beg your pardon!|
|Comm. Fred Lotze:||He must not have had very many if he shot himself! Is that what you are saying?|
|Jim:||I'm saying the effects of these liens can be so devastating to the families that they do desperate things. It causes all sorts of divorces. It puts a lot of people into a state of marasmus (a mental attitude where one literally wills themselves to die- a not uncommon condition of P.O.W 's since the Korean War), especially the older people that can't stand a lot of pressure. And it (the fraud) needs to be shut down. Now, they (IRS) come in with their Affidavit, ...that protects the County, and that protects the IRS agent too, really...if he does it right. But if he's pulling a SCAM on us...he's transferring that liability to both Tim here and the County (Commissioners), and the Sheriff. I don't like to see that. I don't want to be, or have my people suckered into a scam that's going to come back on the County. Cause I don't know anybody (on the list) that will sue for less than a million dollars. And you have 2000 people in this little county (that are IRS/County victims) with damages.|
|Jim:||And like I say, we are here as your friends. We are here to give you all the backing we can, but we want this (FRAUD) shut down. That's all I have to say. Sure, any questions?|
|Tim Hoecher:||I have a question! If the IRS brings something in that they want filed, does it have to be filed in a "Notice" of Tax Lien Index?|
|Jim:||Errol Maczum. What he did, he changed the policy (of San Bernardino County), the "NOTICES" of Lien in a "Notice" of Lien Index and that's fair. Because that's what it is. It's a Notice. Sort of like an invitation to dinner. It's NOT the dinner!|
|Linda Bevs:||That Statute that you spoke of, is that only for the IRS or is that the (State) Department of Revenue too?|
|Jim:||No, well, this one, this particular one is RCW 60.68 and .025. It's in the packet there. And that's what Tim is stuck with here, because it orders him to take the Notice and file it in a Lien Index. I mean, that's what the Statute tells him to do|
|Linda Bevs:||Can I get a copy of that?|
I'll get a copy of it for you later Linda.
And it (RCW 60.68.025) also says "CERTIFICATION"! That these
("NOTICES") Liens are supposed to be CERTIFIED. Well I've seen two court
cases in the last couple of days on it (THE REQUIRED CERTIFICATION) where
they (THE COURTS) are over-running that (REQUIREMENT).
BUT THE SECURITIES FRAUD--THEY'RE DEAD MEAT ON
THAT ONE!!! Because there is no-way they can get around BOOSTING THE
POWER OF A MERE "NOTICE" INTO WHAT'S TREATED AS A "LIEN".
But it goes in (To the Auditors Office) as a NON-NEGOTIABLE
it comes out (BECAUSE OF THE AUDITORS MISFILING) as a
SPENDABLE NEGOTIABLE SECURITY, BUT IT IS INDEED A
WHAT THEY'RE GETTING TIM TO DO IS TO PERJURE THE
COUNTY RECORD!!! ...AND THEN PUT HIS "SEAL" OF STAMP OF
APPROVAL ON IT!! AND IT MAKES HIM LIABLE FOR THE UNITED STATES
SEALS STATUTES UNDER TITLE 18, WHICH IS THE CRIMINAL CODE.
ALSO UNDER TITLE 18 IS THE SECURITIES FRAUD. But I don't want to
see the county... I do have an answer, I think. I think there is an answer for this
thing that can put a smile on everybody's face! But I haven't got time to discuss
today (I was only allotted one-half hour on the agenda). But there are available
funds, where each and every one of these (2000) people can get everything back,
probably, that they've ever laid into this (IRS) outfit, under the scam.... and NOT
raise taxes a bit. If we can tap into those funds...but, I'm going to need your help
to investigate that and check out if we can actually do that. Otherwise.
everybody's property...when these people (on the list) come and say:
WE WANT OUR RECOMPENSE (FOR DAMAGES). EVERYBODY IN THE COUNTY, THAT ISN'T ON THIS LIST...THEIR PROPERTY IS IN JEOPARDY BECAUSE THE TAXES HAVE TO GO UP TO PAY THIS OFF
We are looking at 2000 "Causes of action" here and about 35,000 people. If there is any way that I can help save that. I want to do that...because these people are entitled to damages...I guarantee it, because I've been there. My wife is on this list today. And I know what it feels like to sit and have the State give away (100% of our Pensions to the IRS) because of the fraud here, wondering how to pay our bills. It's NOT a comfortable feeling, and it makes me want to come back real hard after the cause of it.
|Fran:||What triggered that little incident?|
|Jim:||It's supposed to be an assessment, by an Assessment Officer that has the delegated authority from the Secretary of the Treasury to create the assessment in the first place.|
|Fran:||But, what would it be about? I mean what causes that to happen?|
|Jim:||It's a Shakedown-Insurance-Protection-Racket!!! How much can they beat you down for? Now, here's a thing on...Here's a thing on...(At this point I took up to the Commissioners, a Newspaper article from the "American Bulletin" about Joseph R Bannister--a former top IRS CPA/Officer in the Criminal Division of the IRS, who was determined to shut down the Patriot Movement with IRS "Law". Joe is an honest man of the highest integrity and learned of the fraud that he had been induced into perpetrating against the American people. Upon challenging his Superiors in the IRS to prove his discoveries wrong, he discovered the SCAM that the IRS had him involved in. He is now, though still somewhat naive but less rapidly, one of the most popular speakers in the Patriot Movement and put out a 90 page report, which I have. He is exposing the fraud from an inside point of view. As an IRS Special Agent, one who was way up near the top, he wanted to shut down all the so-called Patriot groups that are out there and he found out about the SCAM that they were operating, took it to his supervisors and they had to let him go because he was onto things (IRS OUTLAWRY) He's just one of a number of similar incidents of good, honest people, but naive people who employed by the IRS discover, to their dismay. the IRS CON-GAME and leave. The highest volume of turover of any agency is the IRS because good people find out they are operating a scam and they leave.|
|Fran:||Well, is it the IRS that puts the names on the list is that what you are saying? I'm just trying to|
|Jim:||They create the assessment and then they bring that|
|Jim:||Supposedly for Taxes. But I'll guarantee you it is not, it is for FINES and it would take me awhile to go into that. I'll bring you the documentation on that if you want to see it. But the assessment is created and they come in with an UN-Certified assessment because the assessment should have the affidavit that somebody owes this. This is an Affidavit of Obligation saying that somebody owes a certain amount, and for what, and they should sign it true, correct and complete, under penalties of perjury. And there is a Section of the Code, (6065 NOT 60.65) that says that we have to sign (IRS Forms) things under penalties of perjury. Well, if we are entitled to equal protection under the Law, it requires their signature under penalties of perjury as well.|
|FRAN:||Would you state your name please?|
|Al Campbell:||The point Jim is making. I'd like to underline. The Question is, what triggers the Lien?|
|Fran:||Obviously something happens. And something causes the Lien to get on this List. Correct?|
|Al Campbell:||Well that's a side issue! It could be addressed, but that is not the subject today! The point that Jim is making is that there is a Tax Lien Index and the IRS comes in with a "Notice" of Lien. A "Notice" of Lien is not a Lien. They come in with a "NOTICE" of Lien and ask for that to be filed in a Tax "LIEN' Index. So, what Jim is calling a Fraud is the "TRANSFORMATION" of the "Notice"of Lien on to the "Lien Index"...and once it's on the Lien Index...the IRS can come in and get a certfied copy of what the Auditor has recorded (AS A LIEN) onto the LIEN INDEX. It's transformed into a different instrument. And the solution that Jim alluded to, was to have a new index - a NOTICE of Lien Index.|
|AND THE AFFIDAVIT!!!|
The Notice of Lien Index is different than a Lien Index.
That's the main point I
think Jim is making today. It's a side-issue guys- what CAUSES the lien is a whole
different subject to talk about. The point here is the difference between a NOTICE and a LIEN and a
|FRAN:||Okay. Thank you.|
|Don Hoecher:||I have a question! Is that a Notice of Lien or a Notice of Intent to Lien?|
|Jim:||No. it's a Notice OF Lien. a 668 Y (c), usually. It's usually against wages. But it goes from a mere "Notice" into this "Lien" Index and out of that emanates a "Notice" of Levy, not even a Levy, but a "Notice" of Levy, and "THAT" they give to the Sheriff to go out and Levy, seize and sell and procure and from there it goes to an auction...if it's like Real (Estate) property, for instance.|
|Fran:||Do you want to go ahead and knock off? There is time for one more question.|
|Jim:||No, I'm done.|
|Fran:||I hate to have such a tight ship, but we've got a really tight schedule!|
|Jim:||No. I understand.|
|Fran:||State your name, please.|
|Linda Bevs:||I'm Linda Bevs. Doesn't it require a judicial decision to get a Lien, versus a Notice of Lien?|
If the Agent/Officer has a delegation of authority to create it, then he can create it for cause,
but, that's not the case as it's laid out. The whole thing (As IRS Criminal Investigator Joe
Bannister discovered), is a Shakedown-Insurance
Protection Racket. It's like having GUIDO/(AI Capone) at the door, saying Gimme so much this week
and we won't break your windows and so forth.
I know this community is just full of people who just aren't going to live this way!!!
We're just not going to live under the threat of scams and frauds and we're going to shut it down.
And we're here, like I say, it's a petition for redress of grievances, to come to the County, where we're reporting the crime, and we want your cooperation! We're behind you one-hundred percent.
|Fran:||Okay, we're going to have to close, I appreciate everybody coming.|
|Ken Scalf:||Fran, can I ask a question? Now he said 21 days, this body is very upset. When can you give us an answer?|
|Fran:||Ken. I don't know, twenty-one days for us is not a long time. We have one Official meeting a week. We have, I don't know how many committees to go to just like tonight. I'm in Olympia twice a week. this year and I don't know, Ken. I can't tell you!!!|
|Ken:||If you don't give us an answer. ..if you don't give this party an answer one way or another, Yes or No, then we have the right to take the next step. O.K.?|
|FRAN:||I guess I can't chance that action.|
|Ken:||You can chance it if you want to Well, you know this isn't a threat. but..|
|FRAN:||It sounds like a threat. I won't go for any threats!!!|
|KEN:||Like I said, we definitely know it shouldn't be. We are here to help. We're here to get behind ya,...we just say, "Do your job", you know...as the fraud is there. This is one that needs to be taken care of. Thank you for your time.|
This meeting was completed and adjourned in just under 30 minutes @ 4:30 P.M.
We then regrouped at a local restaurant, where we ate dinner and I put on a presentation withhout time constraints and an overhead projector.
James Earl. Sr.: House of Shaver. Chairman. Steering Committee.
Businessmen and Property Owners Phone: l (509) 684-7777
C/O General Delivery, Kettle Falls, Washington [Cf. 99141 Cf.]