The Issue: Whether the Trinitarian interpretation is valid.

The Trinitarian Claim

Trinitarians claim that Thomas himself is here identifying Jesus as "God" and they further claim that Jesus response confirms his declaration that he is indeed "God."

What the Evidence will Show

The facts will show that Trinitarians are denying the teachings of Jesus found right here in the Gospel of John in order to make this claim. The facts will conclusively and indisputably reveal that Thomas was declaring that both Jesus and God the Father were present before him.

What the Evidence will Show

There isn't an interpretation of Scripture that illustrates the confusion in the Trinitiarian mind more than this one. Trinitarians imagine Thomas is declaring that Jesus of Nazareth is the one and only God. Such interpretations are unfortunately the result of a Trinitarian mind blinded by his own obsessions and seeing what he wants to see rather than looking for the appropriate answer. If Trinitarians would actually read John's Gospel even just a little more carefully, it would quickly become plainly evident to them what Thomas' exclamation is all about.

Seeing the Father in the Son

In Trinitarian doctrine, the Son is not the Father. Yet, Jesus repeatedly taught that if you saw the Son you saw the Father. And indeed, when Thomas makes his declaration, Jesus immediately refers to what Thomas has seen.

Believe in God; believe also in Me. (14:1).

He who has seen Me has seen the Father (14:9).

He who believes in Me, does not believe in Me but in sees Me sees the One who sent Me.(12:44)

He who sees Me sees the One who sent Me (John 12:45)

Thomas answered and said to him, `My Lord and my God."

Jesus said to him. "Because you have seen Me, you have believed. Blessed are they who do not see, and yet believe."

These things have been written so that you may believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God.

Thomas' words mean, "My Lord (Jesus) and My God (the Father)." When Thomas declares "My God" he is referring to the fact that God the Father was present right there before him in Jesus bodily. No, he is not declaring that Jesus is the Father. On numerous occassions Jesus had taught Thomas and the other disciples that his Father "is in me" (10:38; 12:44; 14:10-11; cf. 17:21-23), a direct reference to the Holy Spirit in Jesus. And now he is declaring that the fullness of the Spirit of God the Father has taken up residence in the risen body of Jesus and God the Father was present there before him in his Son bodily. The very same idea is presented by Paul at Colossians 1:19 and 2:9. John is demonstrating here that doubting Thomas was finally affirming what Jesus had taught the disciples all along. Jesus had taught his disciples that to see him was to see the Father (14:9). To see Jesus was to see the One who sent Jesus, that is, the Father. And that is why Jesus responded as he did to Thomas, "Blessed are those who do not see yet believe."

Jesus had also told his disciples that "on that day" they would know that he was in the Father and at that time he also said "because you will see me you will know that I live." Indeed, Jesus responds to Thomas' exclamation, "Because you have seen me, you have believed. Blessed are they who did not see, and yet believed." Jesus had previously explained to his disciples quite plainly that to see him was to see the Father functionally in the works that he did. However, John has just described to us how Jesus prayed to be glorified with the Father, "And now glorify me, You Father, with Yourself." (17:5). Jesus had now risen from the dead in the glory of the Father. Thomas' exclamation was in response to experiencing the presence of the Father right there before him in Jesus' resurrection glory. At Colossians 1:19 and 2:9, Paul explains all the fullness of deity was pleased to dwell in the firstborn of the dead bodily. The Greek work katoikei ("dwells") means the fullness of God the Father has taken up residence in Jesus. Now that Jesus had risen, to see him was to see the Father, not just in what he did in works, but in what he was in substance, bodily, and this is because the fullness of God the Father was pleased to dwell in him bodily. He is affirming Jesus' teaching that to see him was to see the Father, "My Lord [Jesus] and My God [the Father]."

He who has seen Me has seen the Father (14:9).

Thomas answered and said to him, `My Lord and my God."

Jesus said to him... Blessed are they who do not see, and yet believe."

He who sees Me sees the One who sent Me (John 12:45)

What John's Gospel Teaches Us

Thomas did not want to believe that Jesus had rose from the dead and said he wouldn't believe it unless he seen the marks of the nails in his hands. So Jesus again reappeared and told Thomas to put his hand into his side. Now let us carefully remember that Thomas is beholding the glorified body of Jesus Christ.

He who sees me sees the One who sent me (John 12:45)

Father, the hour has come. glorify Your Son... this is eternal life, that they may know You, the only true God, and Jesus Christ whom You sent... Now You glorify me with Yourself with the glory I had with You before the world was. (17:1-5).

I am ascending to my Father and your Father, to my God and your God." (2:20).

We have seen the Lord. (2:25).

"Eight days later, his disciples were again in the house, and Thomas was with them. The doors were shut, but Jesus came and stood among them, and said, "Peace be with you." Then he said to Thomas, "Put your finger here, and see my hands, and put out your hand, and place it in my side, do not be faithless, but believing." Thomas answered him, "My Lord [Jesus] and my God [the Father]! Because you have seen me, have you believed? Blessed are they who did not see, and yet believed."

He who has seen me has seen the Father (John 14:9).

Jesus prayed to the Father that he would be glorified with the Father Himself. And this is exactly what happened. In his resurrection glory, the fullness and presence of the Father dwells in Jesus bodily. And this is what Thomas is exclaiming. God was indeed before unbelieving Thomas yet this God wasn't Jesus but the fullness and presence of God the Father in Jesus bodily. We are told the very same thing at Colossians 1:19, 2:9, and Hebrews 1:3.

Jesus' God was his Father and Jesus had ascended to God his Father and all the fullness of God his Father was pleased to dwell in him bodily, his resurrected and glorified body. Jesus taught that the Spirit proceeds out of the Father but it was Jesus who breathed on them and said "Receive the Holy Spirit" and the disciples were reminded by that same Spirit what he had previously taught them, "on that day you will realize I am in my Father." Jesus and fullness of the Father in Spirit had become bodily one. Where Jesus is, God the Father also is, and that is why Jesus could breath out the Spirit into the disciples and at the same time taught them the Spirit proceeds from the Father. God the Father who is Spirit was fully present in the risen Jesus bodily and so the Spirit proceeded from the Father right there out of the body of Jesus Christ.

The Significance of Jesus' Resurrection

The Bible teaches us that "God is spirit" (Jn 4:24). Peter tells us that Jesus was put to death in flesh but made alive in the Spirit (1 Peter 3:18). In his description of the resurrection body, Paul explains that Jesus rose again "life-giving Spirit" (1 Corinthians 15:45). Paul describes this same concept in several ways. He tells us that Jesus of the flesh of David was "fixed Son of God in power by the Spirit of Holiness" (Rom 1:3-4) and he similarly says "he was crucified in weakness but lives by the power of God" (2 Cor 13:4) and "we know that Christ being raised from the dead will never die again; death no longer has lords over him. The death he died he died to sin, once for all, but the life he lives he lives to God" (Rom 6:9-10). For Paul this is a truism since sin and death no longer lord over him and Jesus lives by the power of the life of the only God who alone is immortal (1 Timothy 6:16). When Jesus rose from the dead he was bodily changed and his mortal flesh was swallowed up by the immortality of the Spirit. Paul explains that Jesus bodily rose from the dead "life-giving Spirit" (1 Cor 15:45). The Greek word here is a compound word and means literally "life-making" or "life-doing." What Paul is telling us in 1 Corinthains 15 is that Jesus' physical body of flesh changed and became "spirit" such that those two things, spirit and flesh, came together in one body to form one new kind of humanity, a new Adam, the second and last Adam, a new creation of spirit and flesh without horizon where spirit and flesh are together and indivisible, not a conjunction of the two, but the two become one such that he was clothed in the Spirit, his mortal flesh was swallowed up by the immortality of the Spirit, his body consumed by the glory and life of the Spirit, and his risen body is immortal flesh that has been characterized by Holy Spirit. His body had itself become the glory of the Spirit. Since God is spirit by nature, his risen body of "life-giving Spirit" is divinized flesh, divinized humanity. This is sometimes called "divinization" (not to be confused with divination) or "theosis" among theologians who do understand the nature of the resurrection (including numerous church fathers).

You will note that Paul calls the nature of the resurrection "glorification" (15:42ff.), and Jesus had prayed to be glorified with the glory he previously had with the Father before the creation of the world (Jn 17:5,24). The fleshly Word was glorified by the presence of God the Father himself and for this reason Jesus could breath out the Spirit (John 7:39). When he walked this earth, God the Father was inside him but the two were only one in the sense of working together in the works he did. Now Jesus had become one with the Father in substance.

Peter preaches that Jesus has "received" the Spirit in his resurrection (Acts 2:33) and this is why the Spirit was now being poured out on men. John tells us plainly that the Spirit was not yet given because Jesus was not yet glorified (Jn 7:37-39). See also 2 Corinthians 3:17-18. Essentially, the idea is that since God is spirit, Jesus' flesh of mortal humanity was swallowed up and clothed in the immortal divine Spirit of God the Father and his body had changed from a mortal body of flesh of humiliation to an immortal body of flesh swallowed up in the Spirit of glory. In this way his death was swallowed up in victory and his humanity swallowed up in divinity.

At Colossians 1:18-19, Paul explains that all the fullness of the Father was pleased to dwell in the firstborn of the dead, God's risen Son Jesus. He later emphasizes this again when he says, "in him dwells all the fullness of the deity bodily" (Col 2:9). He then goes on to explain to the Colossian Christians that they themselves have this very same fullness of deity (2:10) and the reason for this is that they were baptized into the death and resurrection of Jesus Christ. The difference between the fullness enjoyed by the Christian and the risen Jesus is that the believer does not have this fullness bodily but in the sense that the Spirit is poured into their hearts (Gal 3:25-4:6). This is what it means to be full of the Spirit or to have the fullness of the Spirit; it is the fullness of deity, God. This is why Peter explains to us that we are partakers in the divine nature, that is, the Spirit (2 Peter 1:4). But the Spirit has swallowed up and clothed Jesus' entire body of flesh such that death was swallowed up in life and humanity of flesh swallowed up in deity of Spirit. Paul explains that since they were baptized into his death and resurrection, they too have put off the flesh as he put off the flesh in his death and just as Jesus rose from the dead by the power of God they too have been been made alive together in that same way (Col 2:13; Eph 2:5,8). This is why they too hae this fullness made possible by the resurrection of Jesus into whom they are baptized. So we have Paul teaching here in Colossians that all the fullness of God the Father was pleased to dwell in Jesus bodily upon his resurrection.

Believe in God, believe also in Me

He who has seen Me has seen the Father (14:9).

Thomas answered and said to him, `My Lord and my God."

Jesus said to him... Blessed are they who do not see, and yet believe."

The fullness of the Father is the Risen Jesus

Jesus had taught his disciples that if they had seen him they had seen the Father and in this way he and the Father were one. Now we know for certain that he did not mean they had seen the Father in substance because Jesus also carefully taught us that God is spirit and that no one has ever seen God or his form (Jn 5:37; 6:46; cf. 1:18; 3:13; 1 Tim 6:16; 1 Jn 4:12). If we look at Jesus' teaching in the Gospel of John very carefully, we can easily see that to see the Word was to see the Father and they were one in terms of what he "did" in works, not what he "was" in substance (10:25,37; 14:7-12;15:24). At John 10:23-39, Jesus actually explains this to the Jews but they didn't seem to catch on any better than the Trinitarians. At John 14:10 Jesus tells us explicitly that it is the Father in him that does the works and we see at Matthew 12:28 this is the Holy Spirit (see also Jn 3:2; Acts 2:22; 10:36-38). Morever, the Son is most certainly not teaching that he is the Father but that he came out of the Father since that is what a son is by definition. He taught that God was spirit and that it was God his Father in him that was doing the works of God and it was in this way they were one in purpose and in this way the disciples had seen the Father. They had seen the works of the Father done by the Father's Word, Jesus.

In Jesus' ministry he was one with God in the purpose and function of the works that he did. Jesus prays for this same unity between believers and himself and then later grants them the Spirit which will guide them into that. And so he says, "As the Father sent me, I also send you." But when Jesus rose from the dead he became bodily one with the Father in substance of divine nature and this is what he was praying for in Gethsemane. Now, to see Jesus was to see the Father in a completely new way. The Holy Spirit of God the Father had taken up residence in Jesus BODILY.

For all the fullness of deity" was pleased to dwell in him bodily.

Thomas answered and said to him, `My Lord and my God."

The Spirit proceeds from the Father

Now there is further proof that God the Father was present right there before Thomas. Jesus teaches plainly that the Spirit proceeds out of the Father (15:26) and that the Father will send the Spirit to the disciples (15:26) after Jesus rises from the dead and is glorified (7:37-39). Now this is where it gets very interesting. Just before went up to the Father, he meets Mary Magdalene the day he rose from the dead, but tells her not to hold on to him but to tell the disciples he is ascending to his Father and his God (20:16-17; see 16:28). He had previously taught the disciples that he was going to the Father for the Father was greater than he was (14:28). Mary does what she is told and then when Jesus next appears to those disciples in the upper room what happens? Jesus suddenly appears in the locked upper room and then breathed on the disciples and said, "Receive the Spirit" (20:22). That Spirit proceeds from the Father. And where did it come from when Jesus breathed out the Spirit? From the risen body of Jesus Christ. Yes, the fullness of God the Father was in Jesus in bodily such that Jesus could breath on the disciples and it can still be said the Spirit proceeds from the Father whose fullness was in him bodily. Having been glorified into the glory of the life-giving Spirit bodily the fullness of God the Father was always present in Jesus and this was itself the glory of the Father in Jesus.

At John 14:26 Jesus taught the disciples something very signficant. Let us see what he taught them and then let us see what happened:

"I will not leave you desolate, I will come to you. Yet a little while, and the world will see me no more, but you will see me, because I live, you will live also. On that day you will know that I am in my Father, and you in me, and I in you.....But the Counselor, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in my name, he will teach you all things, and bring to your remembrance all that I have said to you, Peace I leave with you, my peace I give to you"
(14:20-27)

"But when the Counselor comes, whom I shall send to you from the Father, even the Spirit of truth, who proceeds from the Father" (15:26).

"The Spirit was not yet, because Jesus was not yet glorified" (7:37).

Father, the hour has come. Glorify Your Son... this is eternal life, that they may know You, the only true God, and Jesus Christ whom You sent... I glorified You... having accomplished the work which You gave me to do. Now You glorify me with Yourself with the glory I had with You before the world was. (17:1-5).

I am ascending to my Father and your Father, to my God and your God." Mary Magdalene went and said to the disciples, "I have seen the Lord" and she told them that he had said these things to her. On the evening of that day, the first day of the week, the doors being shut where the disciples were, for fear of the Jews, Jesus came and stood among them and said to them, "Peace be with you." When he had said this, he showed them his hands and his side. Then the disciples were glad when they saw the Lord. Jesus said to them again, "Peace be with you. As the Father has sent me, even so I send you." And when he had said this, he breathed on them, and said to them, "Receive the Holy Spirit.

"He who has seen me has seen the Father.... I will not leave you desolate, I will come to you. Yet a little while, and the world will see me no more, but you will see me, because I live, you will live also. On that day you will know that I am in my Father, and you in me, and I in you.....But the Counselor, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in my name, he will teach you all things, and bring to your remembrance all that I have said to you, Peace I leave with you, my peace I give to you"
(14:9-27)

"Eight days later, his disciples were again in the house, and Thomas was with them. The doors were shut, but Jesus came and stood among them, and said, "Peace be with you." Then he said to Thomas, "Put your finger here, and see my hands, and put out your hand, and place it in my side, do not be faithless, but believing." Thomas answered him, "My Lord [Jesus] and my God [the Father]! Because you have seen me, have you believed? Blessed are they who did not see, and yet believed."

He who has seen me has seen the Father (John 14:9).

And there we have it plainly. Jesus taught his disciples that "on that day" they would know he was in the Father and the Father in him. He also taught them at that time that he would be in them and they in him and this happened when they received the Spirit. He also taught them that the Spirit would proceed from the Father and the Spirit would remind them of everything he had taught them, such as, "He who has seen me has seen the Father." Now they in him and he in them in the same way Jesus was in the Father before he rose from the dead. Jesus tells the disciples that just as the Father had sent him, now he was sending them. Like the Colossians, they now had the fullness of the Spirit but not bodily (2:9-10). Jesus now had this fullness bodily and was in the Father bodily and the Father in him. Jesus taught them that they would realize "on that day" that he was in the Father and then he left them with the same Peace that he greeted them with when he returned. He was glorified with the glory of the Father, the Spirit of God and the Spirit that proceeds from the Father was being breathed right out of Jesus himself. As Paul taught, all the fullness of God was pleased to dwell in Jesus bodily, that is, his body and the Spirit of God had become one. Where the risen Jesus was, the Father was. The Father was resident in Jesus bodily. And so when Jesus breathed out the Spirit, the Spirit was proceeding from the fullness of the Father within him bodily. Thomas was affirming what Jesus had taught all along, that the Father was in him and he was in the Father and now even in a more profound way than before. He has been one with the Father in the works that he had done in the Holy Spirit and glorified the Father in that respect. Now the risen Jesus was one with the Father bodily in the Spirit of his God, the Spirit of His Abba Father, God Most High.

I	and	the Father
|	are ONE	|
My Lord	and	my God

"I and the Father are one." - Jesus
"My Lord and my God." - Thomas

Now if John were a Trinitarian who was trying to show us that "Jesus is God" do you really think he would have wrote just a few verses later, "this was written that you may believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God." We all know the answer to that question. We should also be reminded that the Jews did not charge him with being God but with claiming to be the son of God (19:7). Although they misunderstood Jesus, they did not misunderstand him quite as badly as a Trinitarian. If a Trinitarian had been writing the last few lines of John's gospel, we all know very well he would have written, "these things were written so that you may believe that Jesus is God." Unfortunately for the Trinitarian, that is not what John wrote because this is not what John believed.

Summation of the Facts

• After Jesus had risen, he appears suddenly in a locked room. After he touched the body of Jesus, Thomas declares, "My Lord and my God."



• Jesus had previously taught Thomas that to see him was to see the Father and Thomas should be believing this truth. He immediately responds to Thomas by saying that he believed because he had seen.



• Jesus had taught Thomas that he would know that he was in the Father "on that day."



The Bible teaches that the fullness of God had taken up residence in the risen Jesus bodily (Col 2:9).
• Jesus breathes out the Spirit into the disciples. Yet he had taught them that the Spirit proceeds from the Father. He was a body of "life-giving Spirit" as Paul teaches (1 Corinthians 15:45) which means his physcial body of flesh had become one with Holy Spirit.



• Jesus breathes out the Spirit into the disciples. Yet he had taught them that the Spirit proceeds from the Father. He was a body of "life-giving Spirit" as Paul teaches (1 Corinthians 15:45) which means his physcial body of flesh had become one with Holy Spirit.

Call for Discernment

Trinitarians would like you to imagine their theology into Thomas' words and ignore Jesus' previous clear teaching in John at the same time. Given the message of John, and the things John and Jesus teach us in this gospel, there can be absolutely no doubt whatsoever, that when Thomas exclaimed, "My Lord and my God," he was loudly affirming what Jesus had taught him all along, "if you have seen me you have seen the Father," and was affirming that the glorious fullness of God the Father was pleased to dwell in Jesus bodily and was present before him, Thomas, because Jesus had become bodily one with the Father in Spirit in his resurrection and for this reason could breath the Spirit that proceeds from the Father into his disciples. Once again, the Trinitarian has nothing here but his own desires to see Trinitarian dogma where none exists.