By Ben Vendetta

Over the past decade, Flying Saucer Attack (mainly guitarist/vocalist Dave Pearce) has released six LPs, plus an assortment of singles, EPs, and collaborations. From the blissful fuzz pop soundscapes of early efforts like Flying Saucer Attack and Distance to the dreamy hybrids of folk melodies and haunting atmospheric sounds on Further and the brand new Mirror, they're all classics.

Ben: I remember after Chorus came out you said in the liner notes that this was the end of phase one for Flying Saucer Attack. Mirror seems like a bit of a departure from New Lands, however, so are you on phase three now?

Dave: No! This one is probably still phase two. What I was saying there was that I could feel in myself that the initial spark had gone a bit. It wasn't that I was suddenly anti-all music or anything like that but when I was trying to come up with stuff it wasn't really happening. I figured that I had to try to change or something, you know what I mean? So I made that kind of facetious comment on the Chorus sleeve and hoped that I would be able to come up with something that was still valid but wasn't quite the same as the earlier things. It was just a note to myself as well to try to sing a bit better because I'm very embarrassed about my singing, which goes back to that live thing when you're going to end up having to sing in front of people. I've got a real phobia about singing completely, basically. I don't think I'm really a singer. It was kind of a note to myself as much as anything else. I think with the latest one, it's finally kind of come through a bit, you know, but it is a bit of a departure probably. I mean in many ways it's probably exactly the same old stuff because whatever I try to do probably ends up a bit samey because it's the same person. I felt the singing was a bit better. There's less reliance on full-on distortion and stuff like that; a bit more subtly here and there. I was quite pleased with the new one in the end.

Ben: One of the things I noticed on the new album most is that it definitely seems to be your most song-based record. Not that they're the typical verse-chorus-verse things or anything.

Dave: I just can't write proper songs so I have to write sort of rambling songy-type things. I deliberately wanted to have what was a bunch of songs, however abstract one or two of them might be in the terms that there might only be a little bit of singing at one point. I wanted them to be seen, as far as possible, as being songs because I think when we did the first few records, there were a lot of people doing songs, there weren't a lot of people at that particular moment in time sort of mixing in instrumental stuff. Certainly, subsequently—not because of anything we've done—there's been a lot of instrumental records. Obviously, that's a thread that goes through the dance stuff for a good 15 or 20 years, but there weren't many people doing droney instrumentals when we started.

Ben: At the time your first album came out, there was that whole Britpop thing going on in England. You seemed to be reacting very much against that. I don't know if that was conscious or not but you were definitely going against the grain.

Dave: Don't get me wrong. I like a bit of 60's stuff, certainly some of the people they were name checking like The Small Faces. I've always loved them since I was a kid, but at the same time I didn't think much of this Britpop stuff to be honest. There was the occasional song that was alright but it was well over hyped over here anyway. I suppose there was…we had already started before that really took off but obviously what we were doing was on a small scale anyway so it wasn't going to be a political opposition or anyway! I certainly didn't feel inspired to try to knock out Kinks-type stuff because The Kinks did that, you know what I mean? I don't have the ability to do that kind of thing, anyway, even if I wanted to. The point was that, certainly in the intervening years, there's been quite a lot of instrumental stuff and I just thought that at the moment it was absolutely essential to try to get a bunch of songs together. Of course, the direct contradiction to that is such that I have got on with some tracks for any kind of follow-up, most of them seem like they're going to be instrumentals. I really wanted to do one that was all songs because I like records that have songs on them. I like a little bit of Tortoise and stuff, a few of these bands, but I always felt that what I was trying to do wasn't really the hard line post-rock kind of droney instrumental because I always had quite a few songs. A lot of these bands don't do them at all. A mixture is fine if you go from songs to instrumentals in your own thing but a lot of people just do instrumental stuff, but that doesn't really grab me.

Ben: I like all-instrumental stuff, too, but I usually prefer that there are some vocals. You mentioned being unsure of your vocals, but to me they're almost like folk songs with a modern instrumental twist.

Dave: It's interesting that people are still saying that. I think with Further, it was a definite attempt to do that, such as any ability toward that at the time was to do something that was meant to be like Roy Harper or someone like that. Obviously, I can't play as well as him. I wanted to do something that was clearly meant to be that kind of thing or influenced by that but with noises and sounds and stuff. It's interesting that people are saying—like you just did—like even with the new one that it's still working on that principal, which is fine because the kind of stuff I listen to is primarily…actually, I was listening to Fairport Convention with Sandy Denny when you phoned. I like a bit of that and things that are pretty noisy like Bug by Dinosaur, Jr. I like a bit of a spread of that kind of stuff, a bit of noise and a bit of folkiness. I guess, like it or not, I'm going to be operating in those kinds of areas. It's nice that people are picking that up on the new one because I didn't think it was necessarily quite so blatantly obvious as it was with a couple of the older things. That's still there I hope. I guess there's that folk rewrite on Side One "Islands."

Ben: Actually, I think the new album is your most diverse record. There are some of those mellow mood pieces but, at the same time, you have something like "Chemicals"…

Dave: Which on the press release is described as a Chemical Brothers pastiche and I wrote the press release, or most of it, and that's how I described it. I think it's a reasonable track. It sounds quite good fun where it is in between the tracks but it is a Chemical Brothers pastiche. I'm not going to deny that. I thought that in the end, it had it's place. I hope people don't get upset!

Ben: So are you a Chemical Brothers fan?

Dave: I like the odd little thing here and there but at the same it's like when we did that Suede thing all those years ago [Flying Saucer Attack covered "The Drowners" on their 1994 self-titled debut].

Ben: That was funny.

Dave: It was meant to be kind of funny in a way, but it wasn't out and out hate, if you know what I mean? It wasn't inspired by out and out hate because if I hate something, I don't want to refer to it at all. The song itself—I just didn't like the fellow singing it. I still don't. The song was all right in itself. They were getting all that hype in the music press. If there's anyone that winds me up, it's the music press over here.

Ben: It's amusing to follow from here. The UK magazines are good sources of information, like if you want to know about who's recording new material in the studio or something, but at the same time, it's unreal. One week someone's the best new band in the world but by the time their debut album comes out, the press is saying that they're over and they suck.

Dave: Unfortunately, some of these bands are over after their debut album comes out. I know it's always happened, in a way. If you go back to the 60's and garage punk where you are and the Freakbeat stuff over here, where bands were dropped after two singles. You don't know if they could have made great albums. Generally, you need a bit of time to develop. With the kind of pressure that some of these pretty damn second rate people were being put under by being hyped up by the press, of course, they turned in pretty ropey albums and disappearing pretty sharpish, like your Echobellys and people like that. They were supposed to be God's gift and they made a couple of shite albums and disappeared. Recently, over the past couple of years, there were a couple of bands who were given their little lot of exposure, like The Audience and Ultrasound. You know, the fat fellow. They each only managed just one album and they split. Who knows? They might have developed. I think the labels were saying to them "We bought the press up. If they're going to give you a clear run for nine months, you better sell a few records." I don't think either of them did, particularly, so they probably got dropped by the label and, subsequently, split. I don't know. I'm sure some of these people are actually interested in music. I'm fortunate, I suppose, that I've got myself in a situation where I can muddle along without really having to worry about panning to these trends so I can still manage to be a music fan. I try to do my own stuff when I can without it being quite such a profit and loss kind of situation. That's not to say there isn't some pressure, but it's probably not quite as forlorn.

Ben: It's probably more you putting pressure on yourself, challenging yourself…

Dave: I try. I do. Otherwise, you won't come up with anything if you don't. I mean, in some ways you've got to try to pat yourself on the back and say `some of this stuff is alright,' but, at the same time, you've got to knock yourself a bit and say "It could be better, I've got to get the singing a bit better." Things like that! I felt I did a bit on the new one, so that was a relief. It's a mixture. Of course, there's also rampant egomania with whatever you're doing!

Ben: Throughout your career, you've been quite prolific. The gap between New Lands (1997) and Mirror is probably the longest you've had and that's not really that long by current standards.

Dave: Because it's just over two years and I don't think anything was released at all in between. There were no tracks on split singles or singles. There was the Skip Spence tribute album. I think that was the only thing in between. It was all part of trying to make something better. If you succumb to these offers—I'm not knocking it if someone offers you to do a track for something because I remember when ten years ago no one would have offered me anything—but the trouble is sometimes you just say "I've got that thing, which is alright. I could send them that." There's only a certain level of productivity of decent stuff that you can maintain so, unfortunately, if you commit to too many things, you're going to have to hand out a few things you're not entirely happy with and then it gets a bit embarrassing in the long run. So, I thought I'm just going to concentrate on the album and not really do anything for anyone else. It seems to have helped.

Ben: I think it's a great album but I've always been a fan.

Dave: If you think about all these bands…what's this, my fifth or sixth album? It's all meant to be over at that point. So many people are on a slide. I'm not talking in terms of sales because, fortunately, in my case, sales seem to be steady from record to record, but I'm judging it on the musical quality level. A lot of people seem to slide, certainly, by that fifth or sixth one, so I was a bit worried about that. All these people I like, you know, like Can, made some great records but I can't get on with anything after that Landed one. Well, that was his eighth, admittedly, but there comes a point where things don't arrive for some reason.

Ben: 60's and 70's artists, even the ones who fell by the wayside, made more quality albums than today's artist. Today, you'll get people making two or three great records and that's it.

Dave: That's probably a lot to do with the industry, certainly in the UK, the way they try to generate these movements, this year's big thing type stuff. You get this very short term view.

Ben: I think the exceptions are people like you who do things on their own terms and don't rely on the major labels or mainstream press.

Dave: It just seems like the most viable way to come up with some music. All these years I've been given a chance to have a go at it. People have been willing to put a few things out. It seemed the most sensible way to keep things going, not to really get involved in all that game. A bit of thought went into that. I don't know if the majors would have ever been interested anyway to be honest. I've never really approached them. I'd just like to think that at some stage—if I ever reach middle or old age—that some of these albums I'm still quite proud of, do you know what I mean? It's not to say that I make records entirely for myself. They might be self-indulgent, obviously, but I try to make something that people might get something out of. I'm not one of these if someone else likes it it's over types. I'm not really like that. Because I'm fairly shy, I don't necessarily say much to people. I'm trying to use music as some way of communicating something. If you're trying to communicate something, you're not just doing it for yourself are you?

Ben: A lot of people are inspired by music. I think you've probably inspired a lot of people to make music themselves.

Dave: It would be nice. I can't say that I feel like I have to like everything that anyone might have done that might have been inspired by something I had done, but at the same time, it's nice to feel that the process continues. I'm more of a music fan than anything else, so obviously there's a load of records that made me feel that I may as well have a go. You hope that people do care that you're making stuff and the slightly personal reason is so that I've got stuff that I can go out and buy to listen to. I don't know if what I've done has inspired very many people.

Ben: You don't feel like you had an impact on this whole space rock movement? When you started there weren't many people doing what you do.

Dave: There was a time wasn't there when there wasn't really anything much like that around. There had been stuff like that a few years before and a few years after.

Ben: Like Spacemen 3 in the late 80's.

Dave: Loop, Spacemen 3, A.R. Kane, My Bloody Valentine, there was something going on there. Then it turned into people like Ride and Slowdive, which I thought was a bit lacking in a way compared to something like Spacemen 3 or Loop. A.R. Kane was my favorite. Come the '93-'94 era no one was doing that anymore. When we started we were called shoegazing four years too late and then two years later we were called yet another space rock band. If you go back to '93-'94, Labradford were already going and even Windy & Carl had put out a few singles. There was a lot of Krautrock that was getting reissued on CD and stuff. It seemed like there were suddenly a lot of people doing this space rocky stuff. I don't know what the story is really there. I would like to feel that people have got something out of the stuff I've done.

Ben: What struck me from the beginning when I first heard you was the contrast in sound. You had this noisy feedback and distortion, which reminded me of the early Jesus and Mary Chain and My Bloody Valentine, but, at the same time, you had these almost gentle melodies running through. You seemed to be pushing sounds to both extremes, which was really refreshing.

Dave: Well, that's what I was trying to do. That was certainly a conscious attempt. I'm glad someone liked it!

Ben: Having been at Terrastock, I can safely say that a lot of people were excited to see you. You definitely have at least a strong cult audience, people that have all your records and stuff.

Dave: I'm pleased. I'm not knocking any of it. I'm probably that kind of person when it comes to other people's stuff. I kind of behave like that. So am I saying anything here?

Ben: Oh yeah, this is very interesting. It's apparent that you believe in what you're doing and you're doing it for all of the right reasons.

Dave: Well I hope so. It's the same with anything in life, trying to be a reasonably pleasant person and stuff. Given the chance anyway.

Ben: It seems like so many people in music are just doing it because they want to be famous or something. They're not really doing it for artistic reasons.

Dave: I don't think that's my overriding concern.

Ben: Oh no, I wasn't thinking of you! I was thinking more about these bands whose only goal in life seems to be to get on the cover of NME.

Dave: Oh yes, I think there's a bit of that over here. Not my kind of scene, I must admit. Ask me about something else because you're making me embarrassed!

Ben: One thing I wanted to talk about is how when you started you were really, I wouldn't say anti-technology, but you were as low budget as possible with the four track recordings and praising vinyl over CD. How do you feel about that stuff now?

Dave: I still listen to loads of records and hardly any CDs. That's just a personal thing. My opinion on the difference now is that all these media for buying your sound or listening to your sound or whatever, they all sound wrong if you analyze it, but vinyl sounds wrong in the nicest way to me anyway. Maybe CD is more accurate and everything compared to vinyl but I just prefer the way it's wrong when it comes to vinyl if the stuff is mastered well, like all those problems with vinyl like a little bit of crackle and a bit of over warped sound and all these things. That ties in with the other part, the music making technology. It's not that I'm completely against dance music or the sounds of dance music or the rhythms of dance music. What used to piss me off about a lot of that stuff was that it was so in time with itself that it became…I suppose it's alright if you're going to be in a club because you want it to be perfectly in time because ecstasy is all about repetitive movement, isn't it? You need it to be right on the nail, the beat, because anything that isn't really jars, and when you're in a lead up state it can really throw you, or so people say. I'm not interested in that. If you're just sitting at home with a cup of tea, the stuff is fucking boring because it's so completely in time. My beef is really with that side of it. The argument, I think, in the early days, there seemed to be this thing going on about records are rubbish, CDs are great. A lot of people were only putting stuff out on CD. It was all tied in with this sort of sequencers and samplers are great and if you pick up a guitar you're an idiot.

Ben: It seems like every few years you get people saying that guitars are over and some form of electronic music is the future.

Dave: People have been making that kind of music since the 40's. The electric guitar has only been around a little longer than the first synthesizer-type things. Which one is actually more new than the other? There's so much bullshit around dance music—`we're so great because we're the future.' You listen to it and you think, where's the evidence? Some of it is quite joyful but it's not the future. For a start, it's now. Where are any signals in dance music that it's any form of future music? It's the all prevailing now. It's current. It hasn't really developed in ten or twelve years, so bugger them. It's just propped up bullshit, these kids walking down the street thinking they're clever because they have a bag from a dance shop with a couple of 12" singles in. You can't walk down the street with an acoustic guitar and expect people to think you're hip.

Ben: They'll think you're a hippie.

Dave: Or an idiot. These people are deluding themselves. I think there's a belief system you have to buy into to listen to all that stuff. It doesn't really work with me. It doesn't really cut it in the long run. What I do is old fashioned as well. I ain't denying that. There's a lot of bullshit talked about dance, probably more than about guitar music, that's what I'm saying.

Ben: There are ideas that have been floating around music for years. I think the trick is to put an original twist on it.

Dave: I think the only way to do that is to actually let some of yourself creep in a little bit. A lot of the people who are seen over time as being the more interesting people like Syd Barrett or Nick Drake or Can or even Kraftwerk, clearly there is a lot of them in their music. Tim Buckley or someone. Ten years ago, there was nothing by Tim Buckley available. Now it's all out there. These people for better or worse were allowing themselves to be themselves. Kraftwerk are pretty dour fellows who liked to make sure everything was in time and neat. That's fine but at least they were allowing that to come through in their music. Obviously, someone like Syd Barrett, the poor fellow was in a state but…it's a bit of honesty, I suppose, what I'm talking about. I think, obviously, there's the argument that there's nothing new, but at least if you're allowing yourself to be yourself, there's only one you so maybe something interesting will creep in there. If anyone had all the answers to this, it would be an entirely different game, wouldn't it?

Ben: I think that's the bottom line. You do have to be yourself. Are you a fan of many contemporary artists or do your favorites tend to be artists from the 60's and 70's, such as those that you just mentioned?

Dave: It's difficult to answer that because in a way I always find that I never really work out that I like something until I've heard it on and off for quite a long period of time so I'm normally a few years behind. I might hear something that's just come out but I probably won't work out whether I really love it or not for about three years. It's difficult to answer that. Of all people, I've been replaying some of those early Tortoise things. At the time I thought it wasn't too bad. I found a copy of the first album and put it on recently and enjoyed it far more now than I did when it came out. My opinion's in a bit of a state of flux. With the old stuff, a lot of records came out in the 60's and I was living in the 60's but you wouldn't necessarily know about some of those interesting psychedelic things. It's because of the archaeology that has subsequently been done that you can pick and choose more than you probably could at the time. There are all these factors. I think I'm old fashioned nonetheless.