Case of apparent unintentional misrepresentation that led to unfair
feedback.
In this transaction:
We were: “Buyer”
Counter Complaint is
Against: “Seller”
Seller offered 2 items in 2
auctions (as below): Such were pictured and described different than we found
later. We give credit that the seller was very professional and friendly in
e-mail exchanges. Seller agreed with our premise of his alleged “unintentional
misrepresentation.” We, (the Buyer) agreed to fully pay the Seller’s e-Bay fees
for this apparent misunderstanding. The Seller refunded the balance to us,
although he sent it as “rec’d payment to our account, so we got charged for
receiving our own funds. The Seller should have refunded the amount, and asked
us send him what he requested. We were under no obligation to pay e-bay fees to
a Seller, as e-bay will credit Sellers on transactions where both parties
mutually agree to terminate, as it was in this case.
The reason for this public post: The Seller acknowledged his “unintentional
misrepresentation” statements in his own auctions; then accepted money from us
a professional courtesy to reimburse his costs in the transaction; then decided
to post negative feedback anyway without further comment, advisement or
warning. We argue the Seller’s negative feedback is unjustified.
We are challenging the
auctions due to the unfair negative feedback.
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1988 Topps BB Box |
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Item # 1980425296 |
Sports:Trading
Cards:Baseball-MLB:Boxes:1980-89
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Current bid |
US $8.00 |
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Starting bid |
US $8.00 |
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Quantity |
1 |
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# of bids |
Bid
Occurred: Dec-16-02 |
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Time left |
Auction has ended. |
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Location |
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Started |
Dec-09-02 |
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Ends |
Dec-16-02 |
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Seller (rating) |
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High bidder |
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I have a case of 1988 Topps Baseball boxes that I bought back in '91. I just opened up the case and am selling them off so they are guarenteed unopened wax packs. Buyer pays $8.50 shipping.
AND the following auction (ending about same time)
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1989 Topps BB Box |
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Item # 1980426408 |
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Current bid |
US $8.00 |
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Starting bid |
US $8.00 |
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Quantity |
1 |
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# of bids |
Bid Occurred: Dec-16-02 |
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Time left |
Auction has ended. |
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Location |
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Started |
Dec-09-02 |
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Ends |
Dec-16-02 |
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High bidder |
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Description |
I have a case of 1989 Topps Baseball boxes that I bought back in '91. I just
opened up the case and am selling them off so they are guarenteed
unopened wax packs. Buyer pays $8.50 shipping.
Original email sent via ebay system (no
copy remains on our side). Our inquiry to the Seller had to do whether the box
had 24 or 36 items as shown in the picture because we could not determine total
quantity of 24 or 36 which is more common a box. Text description suggests “box.” In most
auctions, what you see in a picture in up for sale. Not in either of the auctions
we bid on. The following is the response sent to us from the Seller.
Our e-mail
From Seller: wssunder
A case of 36
boxes would be several hundred dollars as there are 36 boxesper
case. Each box contains 36 wax packs. As
the item description states:"1989 Topps BB
Box". Not the case of boxes.
Sorry, perhaps this could be clearer, but the category in which it is soldis under box and not case as well "Sports:Trading
Cards:Baseball-MLB:Boxes:1980-89 ".
>>>>Our
comments (as buyer): The seller did not state anywhere in the auctions that
item(s) up for bid were “Not the case boxes.” This statement was made by the
Seller after the auction, claimed in seller’s email. Seller also agreed that
the auction(s) description “could be
clearer.”
Our e-mail To Seller: wssunder
After carefully reviewing
the auctions, they both show a photo of a "box" (a case box photo);
with a description stating that you have a "case," which would tell us
that you are selling the case as what is shown in the photo.
I understand that your title says "BB Box." But perhaps you could
also see that when reading the description, and looking at the picture, it
looks like there is a single brown and green case box of BB Topps,
which looks like that was up for sale; and that's what we were under the
impression was up for bids.
We've seen cases sell all over ebay for as little a
$20, and didn't think this was any different. We didn't seek to purchase a
single Topps wax box. No worries though. I'd agree
that the auctions should be more clear in text and
show photo of only the item up for sale.
Because of the representation was different from how they appear, we would
appreciate if you would kindly just refund both auctions via pay pal, and
negate the transaction if that is acceptable to you because of this
misunderstanding.
Appreciate your understanding as well. Hope we can still be e-bay friends :)
Our e-mail
FROM Seller: wssunder
As you know as
a dealer in the business, Wax boxes of Topps,
regardless of year, go for no less than $8ea and a case is a couple
hundred dollars minimum. Yes, there may be some folks out there that
don't know what they are doing and you may be able to find them. You
assumed it was a steal and it wasn't until after the auction that you
asked for clarification.
And as per the
instructions from ebay "You should contact the seller to resolve
any questions before bidding."
In any case, I
believe that you should get what you believe you payed
for. I am not out to rip anyone off. Hence, if you are willing to
forego the cost to me with posting/refunding the auctions, I will be more than
happy to refund the difference to you. I will be sure and make it clear
in my description next time.
Our e-mail To Seller: wssunder
That
sounds fine. Please deduct the cost of what ebay
charges you for the end of auction transaction fees so your end is covered.
We have bought 1000s of items "far below cost" including 100s of Topps and similar items for penny on the dollar for the
last 7 years. Thought this was just another e-bay deal.
We do write to sellers a lot and ask questions, the auction seems pretty clear.
Guess we were wrong. Sorry about the confusion. And thank you for your
understanding.
Seller then
posted this in our feedback profile:
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Dec-27-02 |
B |
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Complaint : Nice
folks, but bid/won 2 auctions, then asked ?'s and asked for refund later |
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Our e-mail To Seller: wssunder
You seem very professional
in your emails, was fully willing to the refund; we paid your fees, no one bid
on your auction but us in the last remaining minuet, so why the negative
complaint? We (were) polite in stating we felt the items were misrepresented.
Don't think we deserved the complaint. Care to comment or request removal
before we post?
Our e-mail
FROM Seller: wssunder
The complaint was
valid in that it only stated that you had bid on an item and won, then asked
questions after having won and then wanted a refund.
It took a
great deal of my time having to refund you and relist
the item. Relisting an item not bidded on is quite easy.
Comments:
Since our complaint, the
Seller has attempted to make his auction description for similar item(s) some
what clearer: item: # 1584303034
“I have a case of
Topps BB boxes that I have had since 1991. I am just
now opening the case and selling them off. You are bidding on 1 box of guarenteed unopened wax packs. Buyer pays $5 shipping. Paypal preferred for expedited shipment.”
We would still encourage showing a photo of ONLY the single item up for auction, as other Buyers may be mis-led in thinking the term “1 box” really means by the Seller as “1 box of 36 wax packs total.”
(FYI: The Seller relisted
and sold the item for $5.00, and not the claim by Seller that “…Wax boxes of Topps, regardless of
year, go for no less than $8ea.) (Is that guaranteed? Sounds like a
representation of a guarantee. We sure wouldn’t make those statements unless we
were guarantying a minimum re-sale value. We’ve bought Topps
and other major brand wax boxes for as little as 1 cent on ebay
and through direct purchases with sellers and dealers.)
Q: If one shows a photo of a
“box”, describes in words as a “box”, what would you think you are bidding on?
– A box perhaps? Not in this case.
Fellow e-bay Sellers: Please
only show the exact item what you are selling in photos, and make sure you
clearly state in words EXACLT what you are selling. If you are selling one
item, tell people you are selling ONE item. If you show a picture of a box of
24 items and you are not selling a box of 24 items, don’t show a picture of a
box with 24 items, and then describe you are selling a box! Take a picture of
only what you are selling and state that in words. It can save you if you are
challenged.
FYI: Finally: Sellers can
easily re-list items that are sold or unsold with a few clicks from hyperlinks
that are located under “myebay” and under “items
sold” and “unsold items.” We argue that the Seller’s comments on
