Does arguing with Kirby count as a hobby? Kirby says hobbies usually involve tangibles. Now he says that hobbies you have a choice about. But I like arguing with Kirby, he formulates excellent points. Today I argued with him for 45 minutes about Caprea. I’d have to say that I don’t like arguing with Caprea. He listens poorly. We argued about the film, Taxi Driver. It’s a film directed by Martin Scorsese and staring the talented Robert DeNiro. (http://us.imdb.com/Title?0075314) Caprea told me he wanted to see every film on the American Film Institute’s 100 Best Films list. He said, “I watched Taxi Driver the other night - it was rated at like 50 or something. And it was -crap-There was NOTHING special about it.” That conversation went like this:
[10:36:25 PM] Caprea: I'm making it my perosnal mission to see 75% or more of the 'top movies' list.
[10:36:32 PM] ME: hehe
[10:36:42 PM] ME: sounds cool
[10:36:54 PM] ME: be sure to read why each one is on there
[10:37:03 PM] ME: it may not be obvious
[10:37:07 PM] Caprea: I watched Taxi Driver the other night - it was rated at like 50 or something. And it was -crap- There was NOTHING special about it.
[10:37:57 PM] ME: omg
[10:38:06 PM] Caprea: I don't see anywhere that gives descriptions about it
[10:38:06 PM] ME: don't say that about taxi driver
[10:38:11 PM] ME: that is such a good movie
[10:38:40 PM] Caprea: Taxi Driver was lame. It wasn't a bad movie but it wasn't good either. I can understand a movie being good, but maybe I don't like it. But this movie just wasn't good.
[10:38:47 PM] Caprea: What's good about it? I don't see it.
[10:38:57 PM] ME: the direction
[10:39:14 PM] ME: i'm too busy to look up a description for u
[10:39:16 PM] Caprea: from mild-mannered to quick-tempered?
[10:39:33 PM] ME: me?
[10:39:46 PM] Caprea: no, the taxi driver
[10:39:50 PM] Caprea: Is that what you mean?
[10:40:13 PM] ME: maybe u should just stick to movies like its a wonderful life
[10:40:16 PM] Caprea: there wasn't anything in that movie I haven't seen done better.
[10:40:35 PM] ME: in later films
[10:40:57 PM] ME: somethings good when it does it first
[10:40:58 PM] Caprea: I've seen it's a wonderful life. It's an okay movie. And I'm trying to broaden my horizons.
[10:41:14 PM] ME: that's on the top afi list
[10:41:15 PM] Caprea: It was already done in Godfather
[10:41:26 PM] ME: what was?
[10:42:12 PM] Caprea: the story, but better. And for the record, I don't really like Godfather as much as other people - but I do acknowledge it as a quality movie.
[10:42:42 PM] ME: then u best not watch the movies on the list
[10:42:55 PM] ME: cause they're not on there for STORY-time
[10:42:56 PM] Caprea: why not?
[10:43:11 PM] Caprea: that's not what I mean.
[10:43:30 PM] ME: yes it is
[10:43:54 PM] Caprea: I can spot a movie that is a cut above the rest - Taxi Driver isn't one of them.
[10:44:10 PM] Caprea: You're just being difficult
[10:44:34 PM] ME: ur being difficult
[10:44:40 PM] ME: ur calling things not good
[10:44:50 PM] ME: but u don't spend the time looking up why theyre on the list
[10:45:21 PM] Caprea: there's no information given.
And who says I have to agree with all 100 movies they put on the list? I think that one doesn't belong.
[10:45:59 PM] ME: fine
[10:46:04 PM] ME: then look up why its on there
[10:46:18 PM] ME: u have the whole internet and there is NO info on that movie?
[10:46:20 PM] Caprea: "There isn't any information given"
[10:46:33 PM] Caprea: I'm looking it up on IMDB now.
[10:47:41 PM] Caprea: okay, I looked up why, and I still stick by my first impression. It doesn't belong. There are countless movies that could take it's place.
[10:47:41 PM] ME: its not on there
[10:47:49 PM] ME: like what?
[10:47:52 PM] Caprea: it is.
[10:48:11 PM] ME: then why didn't u see it before
[10:48:32 PM] Caprea: .... AFI and IMDB are not the same people.
[10:48:45 PM] Caprea: I wanted to know why AFI put it on their list.
[10:48:51 PM] ME: sorry misread
[10:48:57 PM] Caprea: Ah.
[10:50:18 PM] ME: found my old film journal
[10:50:33 PM] ME: i'd type everything but that would take too long
[10:51:07 PM] Caprea: I'm a smart guy, just offer main idea and I can try and figure out the rest of what you're trying to say.
[10:52:22 PM] ME: its too much to explain
[10:52:42 PM] Caprea: You don't have to explain it all.
[10:53:21 PM] ME: i can't explain part of it
[10:53:33 PM] ME: i'll just bring my journal with me in my car
[10:53:41 PM] ME: next time i see u i'll explain it
[10:54:32 PM] Caprea: Well, pardon my cynicism, but I'm critical of your opinion, and that you may just like it, for the sake of so many others (teachers/people in charge) who enjoyed it.
[10:55:34 PM] ME: sure u believe that
[10:55:50 PM] ME: but if the only thing that makes a movie is the story then i'm not talking film to u
[10:56:07 PM] Caprea: It isn't...
[10:56:07 PM] ME: cause u wouldn't get it
[10:56:13 PM] ME: and i'm too busy
[10:56:23 PM] Caprea: bah, humbug.
[10:56:41 PM] ME: sometimes u need to understand why ppl like a movie
[10:56:44 PM] Caprea: I mentioned story as one part of a package.
[10:56:47 PM] ME: i like it cause the character
[10:56:55 PM] ME: and the transformation
[10:56:57 PM] Caprea: I do, better than most people in fact.
[10:57:12 PM] ME: and the anti-archetypal american hero
[10:57:34 PM] ME: u do what better?
[10:57:35 PM] Caprea: Good, and I've seen all that before - done better
[10:58:00 PM] ME: WHERE?
[10:58:26 PM] ME: just tell me where
[10:58:28 PM] Caprea: Combine Clockwork Orange, Scarface and the Godfather, and you have a movie that covers everything Taxi Driver could possibly have that is good about it
[10:58:51 PM] Caprea: all those are already on the list, and we don't need a list of all the same movies... so Taxi Driver si extraneous
[10:58:57 PM] ME: but those are MANY movies
[10:58:58 PM] ME: this is one
[10:59:05 PM] ME: all of those things in one movie
[10:59:18 PM] Caprea: Any one of those movies is better, and has the qualities Taxi Driver has
[10:59:21 PM] ME: this is redemption through self destruction
[10:59:39 PM] Caprea: your missing my point, are you sure you cna understand?
[10:59:50 PM] ME: i'll agree that godfather is better
[10:59:55 PM] ME: but its on the list too
[11:00:01 PM] ME: taxi driver is a good movie
[11:00:08 PM] ME: that's why its on the list
[11:00:17 PM] Caprea: I wouldn't want a list of all action movies, or all love stories... agreed?
[11:00:43 PM] ME: what?
[11:00:53 PM] ME: what does that have to do with anything?
[11:01:12 PM] Caprea: If youd just give me a chance you'll see...
[11:01:17 PM] ME: go for it
[11:01:51 PM] Caprea: A list of movies that is all the same genre, is not a list of the best movies of all time... it's the best of that genre...
[11:02:37 PM] Caprea: Including Taxi Driver, as I see it, is too much. It doesn't have enough going for it to warrant yet another one of those movies. If we are going to include yet another one, it ought to be a better one.
[11:03:01 PM] ME: like what movie?
[11:03:02 PM] Caprea: There are enough narratives like it on the list, to cover that genre.
[11:03:11 PM] ME: which movie should it be replaced by
[11:03:19 PM] Caprea: Fight Club, for example, but I'm pretty sure it's on the list already
[11:03:23 PM] ME: its not on there because its a narrative
[11:03:25 PM] Caprea: Lets make it a higher number
[11:03:38 PM] ME: make what?
[11:03:40 PM] Caprea: You cna't prove it's not there because of that.
[11:03:54 PM] ME: can't prove what is where
[11:04:05 PM] Caprea: there's no reasoning provided that Taxi Driver is ranked where it is.
[11:04:05 PM] ME: use better pronouns
[11:04:16 PM] ME: i don't have time for this
[11:04:28 PM] Caprea: okay.
[11:04:46 PM] ME: fight club isnt on there because it is made after taxi driver
[11:05:11 PM] ME: taxi driver did the redemption through self destruction first
[11:05:19 PM] Caprea: .... Grrr.... Bets movies of ALL time. Yes, you get points for being first, but not that many.
And yes it is on there
[11:05:24 PM] ME: u can't award a movie for copying another on
[11:05:25 PM] ME: one
[11:05:30 PM] Caprea: No, Godfather did it first
[11:05:57 PM] ME: godfather 2 actually
[11:05:59 PM] Caprea: Fight Club in no way copies. Your thesis is lacking, Txi copied, too. That's another problem I have with it
[11:06:22 PM] Caprea: Godfather is better than Godfather 2, in my opinion.
[11:06:28 PM] ME: fine
[11:06:34 PM] ME: but that has nothing to do with it
[11:06:45 PM] Caprea: agreed
[11:06:47 PM] ME: are u listening to what I AM SAYING?
[11:06:58 PM] ME: about redemption
[11:07:14 PM] Caprea: Yes, I am. Are you listening to me, or just trying to convince me to agree with you?
[11:07:24 PM] ME: no
[11:07:30 PM] ME: i'm trying to explain this to u
[11:07:37 PM] ME: but it doesn't seem that ur hearing me
[11:07:49 PM] Caprea: no, you're not listening to me? Use better pronouns! =p
[11:08:08 PM] ME: which pronoun did u have a problem with?
[11:08:15 PM] Caprea: I hear you loud and clear. My point stands. It's been done before, and it's been done better.
[11:08:37 PM] ME: i said that to u because ur indefinate pronouns got distracting
[11:08:44 PM] ME: and i didn't know what the hell u said
[11:08:55 PM] ME: so i needed claification
[11:08:55 PM] Caprea: I think I should let you get back to what you're doing...
[11:09:04 PM] ME: so tell me
[11:09:18 PM] ME: what is it that other movies did first and better?
[11:10:44 PM] Caprea: Your redemption.
though I think Taxi Driver isn't quite redemption
[11:10:50 PM] Caprea: but I'll go with it.
[11:11:35 PM] ME: so what is it that it did?
[11:11:39 PM] ME: come on chris
[11:11:52 PM] ME: ur saying u've seen it better so tell me what it is
[11:12:01 PM] Caprea: I don't understand your question
[11:13:00 PM] Caprea: The narrative, and evolution of a character. A character that yuo grow akin to throughout the movies as if it were yourself. You become attached. In a movie like this, feelings of sorrow, or joy are quite common.
[11:13:19 PM] ME: no
[11:13:26 PM] ME: u said to me " It's been done before, and it's been done better."
[11:13:27 PM] Caprea: what do you mean NO?
[11:13:38 PM] ME: what i want to know is...
[11:13:46 PM] ME: what do u mean by "it's"
[11:14:07 PM] ME: does that question make sense?
[11:14:17 PM] Caprea: it = that long summary I just said
[11:14:34 PM] ME: well yeah that's been done better
[11:14:49 PM] ME: but that "it" is not why that movie is on that list
[11:14:58 PM] Caprea: I'm glad we could reach a conclusion
[11:15:00 PM] ME: do u understand
[11:15:03 PM] ME: good
[11:15:22 PM] Caprea: I do understand. I'd ask you why you think that it's on the list, but you already said it's too long
[11:15:55 PM] Caprea: I wish we had a reason from the list makers.
[11:16:14 PM] ME: plus i'd be better at this if i had seen it recently
[11:16:17 PM] Caprea: Have you seen Pi yet?
[11:16:24 PM] ME: no
[11:16:34 PM] Caprea: American Beauty?
[11:16:58 PM] ME: yes
[11:17:32 PM] Caprea: Not trying to argue or antyhing, but just offhandedly, I see salvation/redemption in that.
[11:18:08 PM] Caprea: Oh, now I'm angry. and I have my conclusion...
[11:18:20 PM] Caprea: Here it goes: Pi should replace Taxi Driver on the list.
Well that was the hellish conversation that drove me nuts. I don’t know why I let him get under my skin. I was bothered by the fact that it really does seem like the only thing to make a good movie to him is the story despite him saying that he doesn’t think that way. I’m bothered he has both the naïveté and the pretentiousness to say he knows better than AFI. Arg… I’m just bothered by him and I don’t know why. Geez, just thinking about that conversation makes me tired. …later.