Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, I call tonight's study, Playing with Fire.

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, Turn to 1 Samuel 28.

 Wvstarwolf_OAM_Counselor says, nice title Deb!

 jesusworker_99 says, OK

 Serving_A_Loving_God says, ok

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, In verse 3 we read, "Now Samuel was dead, and all Israel had mourned for him and buried him in his own town of Ramah. Saul had expelled the mediums and spiritists from the land."

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, Remember that Samuel and Saul had a falling out before Samuel died.

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, Does anyone remember the reason?

 jesusworker_99 says, BECAUSE HE LOST T HE KINGDOM TO DAVID

 Wvstarwolf_OAM_Counselor says, because Saul went against God

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor gives Donna the gold star this time.

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, Saul was told to completely destroy the herds and people in a specific place....

 Wvstarwolf_OAM_Counselor says, right and he didn't do that

 jesusworker_99 says, RIGHT

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, And when Samuel came to visit, he asked Saul, "What is the bleating in my ears?"

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, Saul thought he could hide his disobedience from God, but it was not true.

 Serving_A_Loving_God says, listens

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, God had passed the word onto Samuel and Samuel confronted Saul about it, making all kinds of excuses as to why he disobeyed.

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, Tonight we're going to see the final disobedience of Saul, when he tried to play with fire and got mega burned.

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, In verse 3 that we mentioned above, what was Saul commended for?

Main Entry:            ¹me·di·um <img src="/images/audio.gif" border=0 height=11 width=16>

Pronunciation:       'mE-dE-&m

Function:                noun

Inflected Form(s): plural mediums or me·dia <img src="/images/audio.gif" border=0 height=11 width=16> /-dE-&/

Etymology:              Latin, from neuter of medius middle -- more at MID

Date:       1593

1 a : something in a middle position b : a middle condition or degree : MEAN

2 : a means of effecting or conveying something: as a (1) : a substance regarded as the means of transmission of a force or effect (2) : a surrounding or enveloping substance (3) : the tenuous material (as gas and dust) in space that exists outside large agglomerations of matter (as stars)  <interstellar medium> b plural usually media (1) : a channel or system of communication, information, or entertainment -- compare MASS MEDIUM (2) : a publication or broadcast that carries advertising (3) : a mode of artistic expression or communication (4) : something (as a magnetic disk) on which information may be stored c : GO-BETWEEN, INTERMEDIARY d plural mediums : an individual held to be a channel of communication between the earthly world and a world of spirits e : material or technical means of artistic expression

3 a : a condition or environment in which something may function or flourish b plural media (1) : a nutrient system for the artificial cultivation of cells or organisms and especially bacteria (2) : a fluid or solid in which organic structures are placed (as for preservation or mounting) c : a liquid with which pigment is mixed by a painter

usage see MEDIA

 Wvstarwolf_OAM_Counselor says, turning away witchcraft!

 jesusworker_99 says, BANNNED ALL MEDUIMS

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, yes, banning mediums and spiritists.

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, A medium is one who is a channel of communication between the earthly world and a world of spirits.

 Serving_A_Loving_God says, ran into one of those up in Gettysburg this weekend

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, When I was in France, I saw many advertising all over the place.

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, What would a spiritist be?

 jesusworker_99 says, A WITCH

 Wvstarwolf_OAM_Counselor says, mrs. cleo for example!

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, Actually, it's kind of a broad term for someone who consults spirits.

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, This could mean a witch.

 Wvstarwolf_OAM_Counselor says, fortune teller

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, Or it could be what we have today, a psychic.

 Wvstarwolf_OAM_Counselor says, couldn't think of that word

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, Does anyone here know what the word occult means?

 jesusworker_99 says, PSYCHIIC FREINDS  NETWORK

 Wvstarwolf_OAM_Counselor says, to cover?

pattymack2 says,  relating to the supernatural

denisejc_32 says, it means trouble that's all I know

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, lol, you used the define, didn't you, Donna?

 Wvstarwolf_OAM_Counselor says, yeppers..........cheated

€  ParepidemosOAMpastor says, lol, so did I, kind of an evasive description

 jesusworker_99 says, I   TRIED THE DEFINE FEATURE  AND IIT CAME UP  REAL SMALL

 Wvstarwolf_OAM_Counselor says, lol

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, occult comes from the Latin word to hide.

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, When we are dealing with things that are occultic, we are dealing with things that are "hidden" from the majority of people.

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, People involved in the occult believe that they have knowledge that is hidden from other people.

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, Psychics believe they have a way of finding out things that nobody else knows.

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, Mediums believe they have a way of contacting spirits who can give them knowledge that nobody else has access to.

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, Mankind has a strong desire to know things that nobody else knows.

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, And this is exactly what happened with Saul here.

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, Let's look at the story.

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, The Philistines assembled and came and set up camp at Shunem, while Saul gathered all the Israelites and set up camp at Gilboa. 5 When Saul saw the Philistine army, he was afraid; terror filled his heart.

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, Why do you think Saul was so afraid here?

 Wvstarwolf_OAM_Counselor says, he was going against God

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, Not really at this point yet, Donna.

 jesusworker_99 says,  DEB WHAT BIBLE ARE YOU USING ( SORRY TO INNTERUPT)

 Wvstarwolf_OAM_Counselor says, God was not w/ him

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, What had just happened in verse 3?

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, I use the NIV.

 Serving_A_Loving_God says, he knew that it wasn't of God the mediums and spiriters

 jesusworker_99 says, SAMUEL HAD DIED

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, Now Samuel was dead

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, yep, Mary gets the gold star this time.

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, You have to understand the situation here.

€  ParepidemosOAMpastor says,

 jesusworker_99 says, AM USING THE BOOK

 Serving_A_Loving_God says, listens

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, Samuel had been God's prophet for almost his entire life.

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, The people living had only known Israel under Samuel's leadership.

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, Even when Saul became king, it was Samuel who was really calling the shots.

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, Well, that is, God through Samuel.

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, So, in a big way, Israel was rather lost at this point because they felt their true leader had died.

 Wvstarwolf_OAM_Counselor says, right

 jesusworker_99 says, YES

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, Saul too was feeling this loss.

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, Even though Samuel had not talked to Saul since that incident with the cattle, Saul at least knew that godly influence was still in Israel.

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, But now, it all seemed to be gone.

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, Saul tried to make up for it by inquiring of the Lord...."He inquired of the LORD, but the LORD did not answer him by dreams or Urim or prophets. "

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, By the way, here's your lucky extra for tonight.....

 Serving_A_Loving_God says, listening

jesusworker_99 listens.

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, The Urim was something that was given to the people of Israel by God to give His guidance to them.

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, In the Mormon religion, Joseph Smith supposedly was given the Urim (and Thummin) to help him translate the Book of Mormon.

 Wvstarwolf_OAM_Counselor says, isn't that a spice Deb?

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, While we do not know much about the Urim and Thummin, we do know that they were used only by the priests in the Bible.

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, No, Donna, they are supposed to have been stones or jewels of some kind.

 Wvstarwolf_OAM_Counselor says, oh okay, I did define and it just says sacred lot

Main Entry:              Urim and Thum·mim <img src="/images/audio.gif" border=0 height=11 width=16> <img src="/images/audio.gif" border=0 height=11 width=16>

Pronunciation:         "yur-&-m&n(d)-'th&-m&m, "ur-; "ur-Em-&n(d)-'tu-mEm

Function: noun plural

Etymology:               part translation of Hebrew urIm wethummIm

Date:       1537

: sacred lots used in early times by the Hebrews

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, Yes, lots as in like drawing straws.

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, But we do know that Joseph Smith's use of them was bogus.

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, In essence what he used was a crystal ball that he looked into and read what was shown him.

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, Just thought you might be interested in knowing that. 

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, Now, back to our story.

 Wvstarwolf_OAM_Counselor says, otay.......listening!

 Serving_A_Loving_God says, it was interesting

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, God didn't give Saul any answers.....Saul asked, but God didn't say.

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, So, did Saul accept that God didn't want him to know this?

 jesusworker_99 says, NO

 Serving_A_Loving_God says, no

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, That's right...instead, here's what he did:  "Saul then said to his attendants, "Find me a woman who is a medium, so I may go and inquire of her.""

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, Now, if you remember, back in verse 3, it told us that Saul himself had been responsible for kicking all the mediums and spiritists out of Israel.

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, Notice the progression of Saul's sin.

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, He started with smaller bouts of disobedience

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, And because his heart was proud, he did not really repent.

 jesusworker_99 says, 7

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, He tried bribing Samuel into getting back in God's favor.

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, But God wasn't fooled.

 jesusworker_99 says, THA TIS LIKE SO WRONG

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, Sometimes we do a similar thing.

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, We tell God we are sorry....but we are not really sorry for what we have done, but only sorry we have been caught.

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, God isn't fooled at all.

 jesusworker_99 says, RIGHT

 jesusworker_99 says, AMEN

 Wvstarwolf_OAM_Counselor says, Amen Deb

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, He sees our heart and knows when our repentance is sincere.

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, When we say, "Oh, Lord, I'm so sorry I got mad at so and so"....and then mutter under our breath, "Even though she REALLY deserved it!"

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, He sees right through us.

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, He saw right through to Saul's heart and knew that it was time to anoint David as king of Israel.

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, And Saul's sins grew.....

 jesusworker_99 says, YEP

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, Now, besides Saul himself, look at the people he had surrounded himself with.

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, When he asked for them to find a medium, did they object?

 jesusworker_99 says, NO

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, No, they said, ""There is one in Endor," they said."

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, Who we spend our time with is important in how our life will be lead.

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, led

 jesusworker_99 says, RIGHT

 Serving_A_Loving_God says, agrees

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, If we surround ourselves with people who will only tell us what we want to hear, and not tell us the truth, we are setting ourselves up for a fall.

 jesusworker_99 says, AMEN

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, This is why the word/faith movement (and many other movements lately) are so popular.

 Serving_A_Loving_God says, they tickle peoples ears instead of telling the truth

 jesusworker_99 says, RIGHT

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, People are more interested in people telling them that their problems are because of little demons running around in their lives than for people to be honest with them and say it is just downright sin that is causing it.

 Wvstarwolf_OAM_Counselor says, AMEN Deb!!!

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, This is why people are much more apt to run to psychologists than to a pastor.

 jesusworker_99 says, AMEN

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, They are afraid a pastor will call it sin, whereas a psychologist calls it a "disorder".

 jesusworker_99 says, RIIGHT

Wvstarwolf_OAM_Counselor tells you,  or a deliverance minister!

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, The men around Saul were the kind that wanted to say what Saul wanted to hear, not to tell him the truth.

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, So, Saul did what so many are doing today, he decided to go to someone with contacts in the spirit world.

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, It is ironic that Christians will be too "good" to go to mediums and psychics, but yet will go to other "Christians" who supposedly have connections with the spirit world.

 jesusworker_99 says, UEA

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, The people we are seeing who claim to cast out demons right and left are just a "Christianized" version of the mediums and psychics.

 Serving_A_Loving_God says, those that say they have a gift of "discernment"

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, They claim to have "hidden" knowledge that others don't have.

Wvstarwolf_OAM_Counselor listens.

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, yes, they call it discernment or word of wisdom or word of knowledge.

 Wvstarwolf_OAM_Counselor says, Amen

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, I see so many Christians who go to churches where people will "tell them their future" all under the guise of being a word of wisdom.

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, It is nothing short of occult practices, being called by Christian names.

 jesusworker_99 says, RIGHT

 Serving_A_Loving_God says, agrees

ParepidemosOAMpastor tells you, ok

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, I have talked to people whose lives have been destroyed because someone had a word of wisdom or a word of knowledge that told them their spouse would become a Christian.

 Wvstarwolf_OAM_Counselor says, the only 1 who knows that is God

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, So, the woman stayed with the husband and let him continue to beat on her just  because someone had said he would become a Christian.

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, Years later, the prophecy was still untrue.

 jesusworker_99 says, AMEN DONNA

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, Sadly, this is not at all what these two gifts were meant to be.

 Serving_A_Loving_God says, has seen so many lives destroyed because of so calle prophetic wisdom

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, The gift of a word of wisdom is when you have the ability to find insights into things that others don't.

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, The gift of a word of knowledge is not a prophecy, but is knowing things so you can better serve the Church.

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, For instance, if someone comes to a pastor with a very tricky, complex situation....

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, If the pastor has the gift of wisdom, he will see a wise solution to that problem that is Biblical, but which would have remained unseen to the person he is helping.

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, A word of knowledge happens sometimes to our counselors here online.....

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, Sometimes we are given an understanding of someone's problems that they have not told us, nor did we have any other way of finding it out, but by the Holy Spirit.

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, This goes hand in hand with discernment, being able to tell who is lying and who isn't.

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, But as for these gifts being used to tell people that they are destined to be married in 5 years and have 3 children....I seriously have my doubts.

 Wvstarwolf_OAM_Counselor says, me too Deb

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, Anyone here ever watch detective type tv shows?

 jesusworker_99 says, MME 3

 Serving_A_Loving_God says, yes

 Wvstarwolf_OAM_Counselor says, yes me, love them

 jesusworker_99 says,  SOMETIMES LIKES  COP

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, Have you ever seen one that uses the phrase, "On a need to know basis"?

 Serving_A_Loving_God says, yes

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, Like the FBI will use a person and say, well, we can't tell you that because it's on a need to know basis.

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, In other words, that person is only given the information they absolutely need to know.

 Wvstarwolf_OAM_Counselor says, yes

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, This is how God works.

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, If God were to unfold all of our lives in front of us, well, we probably wouldn't want to see it.

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, We THINK we would, but I don't think we really would want to know.

 jesusworker_99 says, RIGHT

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, Who really wants to know exactly the way you are going to die and when?

 jesusworker_99 says, I DON'T

 Serving_A_Loving_God says, I don't

 Wvstarwolf_OAM_Counselor says, I don't

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, Who would want to know a year ahead of time that they were going to lose their job?

 jesusworker_99 says, NOT ME

 Serving_A_Loving_God says, it would just worry me to death if I knew I was going to lose my job

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, lol, who would want to go into chat if they knew they were going to get booted all the time?  lol

 Serving_A_Loving_God says, lol

 Wvstarwolf_OAM_Counselor says, lol

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, My parents used to have a Christian bookstore a few years ago.

Wvstarwolf_OAM_Counselor listens.

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, There came a time that they had to close it.

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, For a month, we knew we were closing on a certain date.

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, It was an awful month to work there!

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, It was like being at a funeral every day.

 Wvstarwolf_OAM_Counselor says, hugs Deb!

 jesusworker_99 says, I BET

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, People came in and told us how much they'd miss us and were sad we were leaving.

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, I much rather would have had my parents say, okay, tomorrow we're closing it down.

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, I think it would have been a lot easier to handle.

 jesusworker_99 says,    ME TO

 Wvstarwolf_OAM_Counselor says, probably

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, God has some tough stuff for everyone in this room to deal with in their future.

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, They are things that He can already foresee.

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, But to tell us would do 2 things:

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, 1.  It would scare us to death to think we had to do that!

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, Imagine me giving my French 1 students the French 3 final exam.

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, What do you think they'd do?

 Serving_A_Loving_God says, they'd fail

 Wvstarwolf_OAM_Counselor says, they would probably lose it!...........lol

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, They'd probably want to quit French all together because they would think it was too hard for them.

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, But by the time they get to French 3, we have worked up to the skills they will need to do that test.

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, The tough things that are in our future would look overwhelming to us if we could see them all at once.

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, This is why God keeps them from us.

 Wvstarwolf_OAM_Counselor says, never thought of it that way Deb

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, He knows that He is building in us the skills we need to overcome that obstacle or that tough time.....but we're just not quite there yet.

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, The second reason God doesn't show us our future is because He wants us to trust Him.

 jesusworker_99 says, RIGHT

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, If you see a million dollars and someone hands it to you, how much faith does it take to believe they are going to give it to you?

 Wvstarwolf_OAM_Counselor says, Amen

 Serving_A_Loving_God says, none

 jesusworker_99 says, NONE

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, It doesn't take any faith to believe in things we already see.

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, This is why Hebrews 11:1 tells us that faith is believing in things we DON'T see.

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, It is very ironic that the word/faith people only have "faith" when they can see things happening.

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, That's not faith.

 jesusworker_99 says,  RIGHT

 jesusworker_99 says, NOPE

 Wvstarwolf_OAM_Counselor says, right

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, True faith comes when you believe even though you don't see.

 jesusworker_99 says, RIGHT

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, Abraham believed God even though he was old and so was Sarah.

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, Faith grows in us when we are forced to go past our comfort zone.

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, When we are pushed past what "we" can do, then God has a chance to see if we are really going to believe Him for who He says He is.

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, Saul didn't want to trust God and so he took matters into his own hands.

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, He played with fire and lost.

 jesusworker_99 says, AMEN

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, He stubbornly said in his heart that if God wouldn't give him answers, he'd go to someone who could.

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, This is an attitude we must always be cautious about in our own lives.

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, When someone tells us something we don't particularly like to hear, we must be careful not to go to others just to hear something "nice".

 jesusworker_99 says, AMEN

 Wvstarwolf_OAM_Counselor says, ditto Mary

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, God uses other Christians in our lives to help rub off those rough edges in our lives.

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, It's like being in a rock tumbler......

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, All the rocks roll against each other and in the process, polish each other up.

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, This is what God has called us to do as Christian brothers and sisters.

 jesusworker_99 says, AMEN

 Wvstarwolf_OAM_Counselor says, to lift each other up

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, This week as you are faced with difficult times in your life, look at them as God helping to strengthen your faith.

 jesusworker_99 says, OK

 Wvstarwolf_OAM_Counselor says, otay

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, Look at your brothers and sisters as ways of helping you to polish those rought edges off so you will shine with His grace.

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, Remember, though, to be gentle with your brothers and sisters because tomorrow it might be you who needs the polishing.

 Chalkbrd_OAM_Counselor says, ** the end **