"Weavers Words" Vol. 2 Iss. 111 Date Sent: April 10, 1999 Web Page: http://www.iei.net/~davidc/ Subscribers: 1010 David Collins 408 North Devon Avenue Indianapolis, IN 46219 317-899-5747 davidc@iei.net %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%% Do You Like Weavers Words? Click Below To "Recommend-It" To A Friend! http://recommend-it.com/l.z.e?s=210339 %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%% "Web Cards" - Create Full-Color Postcards For Your Web Page. http://www.printing.com/affiliate.asp?site=davidc For every free sample of "Web Cards" that you request from the above link, I will receive a $1 commission. It cost you NOTHING. Once you receive your free sample, you can purchase personalized "Web Cards" for your web page and/or business if you like. %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%% Subject: Re: "Weavers Words" Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 22:36:51 -0400 From: martyhln@juno.com To: davidc@iei.net Hi David and World Basketmakers...I met a lot of you at Indy and am not even going to try to name, names. But I will say I met David's real good friend Pat Steinmetz, she showed me a real picture of David, Susan the picture of Tom Cruse doesn't even hold a candle to our HERO. Thank you Pat it was so nice of you to share the picture. I was nice to put faces to the names, of the people I did meet. There are more that I didn't meet that I would have like to have met. I am so far behind on Weavers Words that it is awful. But I wanted to respond to these people....Judi, I know it was some time ago that you ask for names for your animals, I thought it might be fun to try to name them. For the tarantula, Fuzzy seems right. for the 6 ft python I think Slither. For the gopher maybe Squeaky is appropriate...Billie, The Shellac that I use is in a powder or flake and is only mixed as I use it...Denise, I would love to see Alastair's willow groves and boiler made from the fuel tank, I am looking forward to it...Anna L, I enjoyed the stories about the hop vine weaving that you did, I will look for your pictures as well, I would like to grow some to play with, do you know if we could get the seeds in the USA...Lois, I am glad, to know the weather there isn't always perfect, If your painting teacher isn't giving the instructions you need find someone else, could be a personality conflict of sorts, next one may be better. I hope everyone had a wonderful Easter. I am getting ready to go tomorrow to the Basket Bash "99" I know it will be lots of fun, small but exciting. I am doing an Antler basket with Pam Woodbury, A stack of 3 with Pat Levitte, and a bamboo basket with Jodi Shebester...Flo it was good to read your post, welcome aboard, say hi to Honey for me. Until next time Peace and love to all. I've got to finish my packing. All of you have some fun weave a basket. Warmest Regards...Marty Holihan...Flint, MI...dholihan@gfn.org (or)...martyhln@juno.com %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%% Subject: Re: "Weavers Words" V. 2 I. 110 Date: Fri, 9 Apr 1999 00:10:47 -0400 From: "Susan Tripp" To: "David Collins" Ms. Ann: I demonstrate at most of the shows I do. Sometimes I am asked to come specifically to demonstrate and they say - oh yeah, bring along your baskets too in case someone wants to buy one - and other times, I just weave to pass the time at a show and it always draws people. I would think most people weave during shows??? Someone here mentioned weaving an egg basket and offering an interested child to give it a try. What a great idea that was. I found that if I don't weave at a show, people don't believe they are hand made. Oooo boy Di! Are you gonna get one heck of a back lashing! That's okay though, some things just gotta be said. :-) Susan from NY %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%% Subject: Thanks to so many of you! Date: Fri, 9 Apr 99 00:19:45 -0600 From: rounds@ionet.net To: Wow! Ruth Emberg...your tip on measuring flat oval is great! I am a new weaver and knowing how to measure for rims without trying to fit it to it and THEN measure and cut...well, it sure was harder! I think your method will give me more satisfactory results. I just viewed a video from the series by Sandy Atkinson and LOVED it! I had planned to write Sandy but when I saw her actually post in tonight's Weavers's Words...well, I just thought I'd make it public! I viewed the College Dorm basket of the 400 series. I don't have the good fortune to see her programs on t.v. but I got to use a video by mail order...and I want the book that is advertised and also to view her other videos. I learned some ore tips on basketweaving from her. It was fun to watch her and weave a basket at the same time! Thank you all for your friendliness and help to new and experienced weavers. It is a wonderful craft to share. Denise Tulsa, OK %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%% Subject: L baskets Date: Thu, 08 Apr 1999 23:16:34 -1000 From: The Keener Clan To: davidc@iei.net Aloha from Hawaii where it is wet and chilly still.....brrr A comment about L baskets--not about the baskets with those moveable spokes :-).... but about "consultants". It is my understanding that the company sets down rules about craft fairs and so on, but those "consultants" in Hawaii don*t seem to follow them. At the largest country fair on our island, I*ve seen L baskets being sold, L baskets that someone sanded off the initials on the bottom and replaced with their own, L baskets that someone signed below the mark on the bottom and said she made them. This fair allows NO services--meaning a L "consultant" cannot offer catalogs, but they do all the time. They know they aren*t supposed to do it (it says so in the contract they sign to get a booth at this fair), but they do it anyway. Usually they share a booth with a crafter and hand out their literature there. No scruples at all--none. At a fall fair at Barber*s Point, 2 L "consultants" set up a booth with lots of L baskets and booked parties....if it is supposed to be a craft fair, where does selling L baskets figure in? I don*t like being a meanie, but I turn them in at the big fair....every chance I get. If it is their contract they sign with the L company, then they aren*t living up to it. The only person who asked me if I was selling L baskets was someone*s husband....he said "oh, are these the L baskets"--he honestly didn*t know, so I wasn*t offended. However, when someone looks at each of my baskets, smirks, and says "These aren*t L baskets"--I get a little miffed.. And we would like to think people can tell the difference between our baskets and imports, but a woman who calls her company "Country Blessings" and does the same fairs I do, sells baskets from the Country Home catalog.....and tells everyone she made them--and people buy them. I have nothing against the L company--just against their unscrupulous "consultants"--and no, I*m not saying they are all are that--obviously just the ones who do business here--and they are, for the most part, military wives--just like I used to be... Lois %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%% Subject: "L" Baskets Date: Fri, 9 Apr 1999 07:32:48 -0700 (PDT) From: Carol Miller To: davidc@iei.net I received an "L" basket as a gift about 5 years ago and I happen to like it very much. No it is not of the quality of the hand-woven "non-mass produced" baskets, but it was given by a very good friend. She has received many of my hand made baskets and is not a weaver, knows my love for baskets and gave from the heart. So many people who have "L" baskets and think they are great are collectors-my baskets are functional and are used everyday. Also something to keep in mind. Basket weavers know the true value of a basket, collectors only know they like it it's an "L" basket! Carolyn B.- Thanks for the dye recipes, I'll save it 'til tonight so my husband can down load and copy for me. This machine intimidates me!! I delete or just plain lose things when I try to do it myself, Its his professional field he can handle it. Carol in Montana where we are receiving snow again. %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%% Subject: "L" Baskets Date: Fri, 09 Apr 1999 10:48:56 -0400 From: "robert n sykes, jr" To: davidc@iei.net Well, after "lurking" for a year thought it was time I jumped in with the rest of you and contributed some thoughts and ideas. Regarding those "L" baskets, one of the first shows I exhibited in had a booth of Longaberger baskets! We weren't very happy about it so on a form they give you at end of each show, when they asked for our comments, we told them these baskets are not handmade and didn't think it was fair that they had a booth along with the crafters! Next year, they were gone. I have a customer who buys baskets from me every year who says she doesn't buy the "L"s anymore since buying mine. She complained about getting spinters in her fingers and hands using them and mine were all smooth sooo tight. Guess we have an educated collector! I have gotten some great tips and ideas from this site. Everyone is so friendly and helpful. Keep up the good work David! From sunny Wilson, NC where the temp was 90 degrees yesterday! Egad! What a summer we're going to have. Robbie Sykes %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%% Subject: Weavers Words Date: Fri, 9 Apr 1999 11:08:20 EDT From: Karitamus@aol.com To: davidc@iei.net Thank you, David, for Weavers Words! I have really enjoyed reading them. Thought maybe it was time for me to jump in with a hello. Hope I'm doing this right! I am just starting to do some shows - or rather I HOPE to do some shows - haven't heard if I'm accepted yet. I would really like to know what the other members think of selling their baskets online - have they tried it? Is it worth it? The shows will probably be a lot of fun, but they are also a LOT OF WORK! Didn't make it to IBA this year - just came too soon after Midwest Basketry Focus (which I dearly love!). I have a 9 year old daughter, so cannot plan too many weekends away - don't want to miss anything! Plus, the major part of my social life centers around HER schedule - typical, huh!?! I'll close for now. Thanks again for a wonderful format! Karita in warm, but stormy looking Bloomington, Indiana! %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%% Subject: misc. Date: Fri, 9 Apr 1999 11:15:36 -0400 From: "Angie Longenecker" To: "David" Hi all, Tony - no offense taken about the patterns - you can't please all of the people all of the time! Ms Ann - I demonstrate at every show I do, no matter where or what it is. Partly to show people and partly to keep my sanity. There's no way I could just sit there all day! Of course the shows that I don't get much accomplished are great too, because that means I'm busy selling! :) Last fall the little girl from the booth next to me was hanging around. So I gave her round reed and she wove with me all day. - No one can say that Longaberger's company is a dud or that they don't support the town or that they haven't made people aware of baskets. It was a great marketing scheme! But, what I (and I know I'm speaking for others) don't like it the status their baskets have reached and the prices people pay for them - they're not worth it! I don't bust on the man - I bust on the fact that people pay outrageous prices for (I'm sorry) crap. I've showed people how the rows are poorly woven and how much space is between them. They're just not woven properly (and that has nothing to do with the nails). I don't want to bust on you now, I just get frustrated that people will buy L baskets just because someone told them that they should. Rainy today, but we need it in PA, Angie The Country Seat http://www.countryseat.com %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%% Subject: general Date: Fri, 09 Apr 1999 11:20:23 -0400 From: roman@tm.net To: davidc@iei.net Thank you Billie for expressing so exactly MY feelings on the pattern discussion. It's an old sore point for many people from both sides of the aisle. To Diane and Jim Langston from Di's Heavenly Treasures: BRAVO. The snipe in issue 109 was shameful. In light of the additional information that you bring to light, it makes it more disgusting that they should sully your name. There are a LOT of tiny changes that are made in patterns then, passed off as "originals". I have an acquaintance that "copyrighted" a Christmas Stocking, Sandy Atkinsons Chip and Dip, and the Puffed Heart that has been around for eons. To a new basket weaver, it makes that instructor look pretty good. My children chuckle at my fuming about such things, but there are politics in all areas. Several issue's back Winnie in Connecticut was looking for conventions/gatherings in June-July-August in her area. I'm blank - anyone else? Time to sign off- Kristin %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%% Subject: Pet warning Date: Fri, 9 Apr 1999 08:44:07 -0700 From: "Ames, Kay H" To: "'Weaver's Words'" I just received this information, and I have to admit I have not verified it. However, avoidance might be a good plan 'til we find out more, so I will share with you..... I have recently read about this product, and thought it might have been on WW. "Please pass this on to any of your pet loving friends! Febreze, a new product that is used to get odors out of fabrics, has been causing death and illness in dogs, cats and birds. There have been multiple instances reported in the past few weeks of dogs, cats and birds dying after Febreze was used anywhere near them. Some dogs have only gotten very ill, but some have died. Several birds and cats have died as well. Febreze contains zinc chloride, which is the culprit. If you have recently sprayed your pet's bed with this product, please wash it until you get all of the Febreze out, or get your pet new bedding. Also, if spraying your furniture, keep pet off. Please pass the word along to your friends so we can prevent further deaths. This was a notice from the Veterinary Emergency Center in Needham, Mass." Kay Harradine %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%% Subject: Re: "Weavers Words" V. 2 I. 110 Date: Fri, 9 Apr 1999 14:16:22 -0400 From: "Donna" To: "David Collins" Ms. Ann - I for one, don't dispute the fact that David L. deserves respect for his accomplishments. However, just as I don't patronize Wal-Mart (here's another empire built by 1 man and employing many people) for how they unabashedly come into an area and drive out independent retailers, I don't want to have anything to do with the L basket (except to repair them as they come into our shop). Yes, the Company serves a purpose - but the hipe being generated by an inferior product is not justified. After all, what ever happened to quality control? If the Company wanted to, they could produce a basket of a much higher quality. Isn't this where the bottom line really is. This is what we gripe about most - that we work very hard to weave a quality product, and they just don't care about it. As long as the "hipe" is there, they do not have to take the time to improve quality. If we, on the other hand, continue to educate the public as to what quality constitutes, maybe, hopefully, in the long run it will increase our sales. Maybe the answer to someone asking or comparing our work to the L basket should be "Oh no, see how much tighter this is woven" or "how much stronger this handle is" . Maybe a constant comparison is what the public needs. Donna L. in the pouring rain of PA http://www.countryseat.com Check out our new online searchable catalog with shopping cart ctryseat@fast.net %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%% Subject: copycats and cut-throats Date: Fri, 9 Apr 1999 17:00:36 -0700 From: "Anne Boquist" To: "Weaver's Words" Jim and Diane, I have some idea of how you feel, probably lots of us do. I weave unusual baskets, mostly from seaweed. My friend and partner, Kathy Johannesson and I were the only ones weaving from seaweed in this neck of the woods for a number of years. We did extremely well, sold everything we made, exhibited in art galleries, had newspaper articles written about us--the whole bit. We taught and shared information with people and had to deal with weavers (one in particular) copy our designs, sell for less and even say that we all learned from the same native woman together, even though she started weaving years after us and we never did learn from a native weaver! It used to drive me NUTS. I think it was even shortening my life! Anyway, over the years I have realized that anyone who copies hasn't developed their own style, doesn't have original ideas and it shows in their work. If you both set up at the same craft fair, as we have done, you'll find that your work will sell better, even if it is a few dollars more--because it shows your personal style and has character that only you can give it. Anyone looking at the work on both tables can see that. A copy is just that. Not to mention my old friend Kharma. What goes around, comes around. Don't worry, we all get what is coming to us, hopefully you will get a good night's sleep now you've gotten all that off your chest. Anne in Sooke, terrified of bad Kharm %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%% Subject: WW Date: Fri, 9 Apr 1999 17:05:55 -0700 From: "Pam Feix" To: CC: "David Collins" Dear Di and fellow weavers, First of all, I want you to know that I am not mad, but I do want the chance to explain myself. I did not tell anyone to try to undercut you, and yes, I said that I cannot afford them. I, personally can, afford them, but to make the basket, which is a very nice basket, and to resell them, I have to find a cheaper source. I sell quite a few baskets and the comment on "The Promise" basket is always, "why does it cost so much." I have even had people trying to get me to take less for them, but I cannot. I am not trying to add the animals to my web site, I am trying to sell the finished basket, and since I thought it was such a nice basket, and so does everyone else, I thought that I would be able to sell more if I could cut my own costs on them. The folks around here do not want to spend a lot of money on baskets and I am trying to support my habit. My basket sales are just my hobby. The base sales are my husband's business and his livelihood. Now, I also want you and everyone else to know, that I am not trying to start a war here, I only asked a simple question in order to help out my costs so that I can re-sell this basket. I am not trying, in any way, shape or form, to keep people from buying from you. I think that there is room for all of us and I have tried very hard to make sure that I don't step on anyone's toes, but obviously, I have, for that I apologize. Trust me when I say that I have done a lot of research in trying to find out the wrongs and rights of this business, but find that there is no one right way and no one wrong way in anything about it. We do not put a base or anything, for sale, unless we find that it is already being sold by others, and when we have special requests. We, too, have had our own original designs copied and know before we even put it out on the market that it is going to be copied. I don't know where you have seen the quality of my finished basket, "The Promise", but that was really not a nice thing to say. I take my weaving very seriously, and I try to do my very best with all of my baskets, whether they are from someone else's patterns or of my own. I take pride in what I make and what I sell and I have a whole lot of compliments on my baskets. I do take this comment personally, as it was a stab at my own weaving abilities. Granted, we all have a lot to learn, but no one is perfect and I truly do my very best anytime and every time I weave a basket. As far as cutting the price of your finished basket in half, I was not even aware of what you were selling it for, and I again, had to figure my costs and the amount that the customers here, in my area, are willing to pay, therefore me selling baskets to replenish my weaving supplies. About underpricing you, we have set our prices to be competitive, and when we add new bases and other items, we try to keep them in the line of the pricing that we have already established. We have not taken your price list and gone through it and purposely undercut you. When we came into this business we had to determine how we were going to charge for bases. We determined the cost of the wood (our cost) and then figure the time into it. We are sometimes lower and sometimes higher on these bases and such, but we are in NO WAY trying to put anyone out of business or trying to purposefully undercut someone. When we add a new base, or item, we look at the prices that we already have established and then try to figure out how much is this price already and how much is this one and try to keep in line with what we have already determined to be a fair market price. I do not know of any of your other bases or anything of yours that I even carry, only the one, and only because we have had requests, and after research, found that it is also being sold by a few others. For you to say that we purposefully used your price list to undercut you, is just not the truth. I am a nice person as well, and I try very hard to get along with everyone and try to please everyone. I think that you lashing out at me, was not just meant to be thrown my way, but to everyone who is in this business, as it is common business practice. I am truly sorry that it is that way, but you and I both know that we are in a business and that we have to be competitive in order to stay in business. Competition is what should make us all strive to be better at something than someone else, and believe you me, we do our best at trying. We are in no way trying to hurt you, your business, or anyone else's business, we are only trying to find a way to fit in here. I also want to make note to you that I have bought more than one base from you, and made many of these for a couple of years and only within the last 2 months has this been added to my price list. My husband has been a wood worker for years and loves it, and frankly, he does an excellent job at it. He has been making bases for me for a couple of years and was trying to find a source of income for when he retired. I told him that he should make bases for others so that we could have an ongoing income as well. We did not do this to put you out of business, or anyone else. I like some of your patterns, but to tell you the truth, I have only made two of your baskets. I truly do not know what other bases we have of yours listed. I even tell people where they can buy the pattern from. I do not copy the pattern in order to sell the base. You can ask any of my customers that have asked me for patterns that I do not carry. I tell them where they are available from. I just think that is the right thing to do. We went to convention and saw our bases (original designs) there as well, and we expected it. I do not copy your patterns, or anyone else's for that matter, in order to sell our bases. The patterns that I carry for re-sale I have purchased from the author. I do know what you are saying, is why does it have to be this way? All I know is that everyone is just trying to find a place to fit into this business and we are all trying to carve out our own little slice of the pie to fit in. I am truly sorry if you think that I did this to upset you or anyone. My husband is just trying to sell his wood bases and I am just trying to support my habit. If I don't sell what I make, then I cannot buy more material, and besides that, I don't have a place to put them all. I have a serious basket weaving addiction and have to sell my baskets in order to continue to weave. I am sorry to all of you, that this is so long, or if I have offended any others of you, or all of you. I am very upset to think that I have hurt someone, as I have tried so very hard to do things just right and following in the paths of the others who are already so well established in this business. I would have responded to Di only, but felt that I needed to share with all of you. Thank you for listening.:) Pam Feix Feix Family Baskets & Crafts http://www.feixbaskets-crafts.com %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%% Subject: WW Date: Fri, 9 Apr 1999 17:29:40 -0700 From: "Pam Feix" To: "David Collins" Oh I forgot, The only reason that I even mentioned that the animals were for "The Promise" by Di's Heavenly Treasures is so that the other weavers would know exactly what animals I was looking for. Thanks again. Pam Feix Feix Family Baskets & Crafts http://www.feixbaskets-crafts.com %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%% Subject: Re: "Weavers Words" V. 2 I. 110 Date: Sat, 10 Apr 1999 20:54:37 -0400 From: "Kati" To: "David Collins" Hi ya'll, I have had the best week off on Easter vacation - I have made several baskets, some for fun, some for preparation for a class I've been teaching at church. The last basket we did at church was a Burgundy Hill Kit - a small market basket. I was overall satisfied with the materials, although I added a few extras like 11/64 FO for lashing and #2 to twine the bottom. The group requested that we do another rectangular basket, only bigger. I agree with Tony that baskets come in basics - we add the extras to make them different. Anyway, I made up four baskets - 1) a Village Tote with seagrass handles, 2) a medium market basket with D handle, 3) a Newspaper Basket, and 4) a simple laundry basket with bushel basket handles. I want to show them all four and let each choose which one they want to make. The basics are the same, just the dimensions and the extras are different. This is a good group of ladies. I will give them each a pattern and a list of supplies for their basket and of course, the number for a supplier, so they can order their supplies. The only problem I might encounter is that some of these ladies are so elderly that someone might not have a credit card - maybe not likely, but possible. I want them to become a little more independent and creative. Also, to Tony, I use patterns, but like you, I mainly get the ideas, then go off on my own. That has made it hard for me to teach, since I have to really think about how I do things. A lot of what of I do is second nature. But I have oodles of patterns - in fact, I love Basketpatterns.com, the best place. My husband hates it. He says I become a deaf/mute when I am online shopping. And, Angie, I love your site! It is well organized and easy to use. If any of you guys haven't visited, try it! I have signed up for the next basket swap and I am so excited to get my partner. As far as the "L" baskets, if they sell them anywhere near me, I don't know about it. I don't make baskets for a living and so I don't run into any dumb comments about what I do. In fact, people down in NC seem pretty fascinated by baskets although I have heard that they don't want to pay much for them. A bunch of people where I work make baskets also, so we talk about it all the time. There's always one in the office for everyone to see. As for Di's Heavenly Treasures, (and since this was posted in public, I think we all can respond...) I hate to see basketweavers arguing - I didn't take Pam's post as an insult to you. With the freedom to own your own business also comes the customer's right to purchase whatever from whomever - chill out!! as I tell my kids. I like many of your original patterns and would like to order some things that I haven't seen anywhere else. Part of my problem is that I deal mostly with a local dealer in Vass, NC and order online. I'm not organized yet to get to the phone or use snail mail. I asked Judy Spates about ordering some of her bases, but still again, I haven't gotten around to it. I hope this can be worked out reasonably. I like to hear opinions, but not anger or resentment. It clouds the atmosphere. Now I'll shut up! But, Pam, I did find my animals at Michael's (a chain craft store). It was a long time ago and I'm not sure you could still find them, but it's worth a try. I had a friend who used a nice set of zoo animals - it looked good too. Well, keep up the good work David - This is my favorite place!!! Kati@carolina.net where it is spring!!!! %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%% Subject: WW Date: Fri, 09 Apr 1999 21:33:56 -0400 From: GTE/sirkim Organization: SELF To: davidc@iei.net I've been reading behind the lines for quite a while now, absorbing the comradely and great advice. I have to finally say that I'm glad that Langston's finally took a stand! I am of the feeling that Pam Feix is walking a very thin line when it comes to the issue of copywrite infringement. I cannot believe that a person could be so blatant about selling someone else's ideas so publicly. The creative spirit is broken when it is robbed so. I admire Jim and Diane and LOVE to take their classes and enjoy their company and now I am being robbed. It seems that their business is going by the wayside because of people who cannot "think" for themselves. I agree that credit should be given to the proper person; that pricing shouldn't undercut the creator's pricing and that permission from the authors is the respectful thing to do. I do not mean to be mean or hurtful either. The art of basketry ought to be a supportive branch that helps the tree as a whole. On this subject, check out the Silver Dollar City brochure in Branson MO. Two out of every three baskets are being taught by someone else other than the author and not one gives credit to the author (did the teacher get permission to teach the basket form the author?). How can someone allow this? (The jurying committee) and how does someone feel right about this in their heart??? (The teacher). The creative spirit should be respected and honored. For that is what inspires all of us; we have only to gain from such artists. We should not abuse the gift.... Karen %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%% Subject: A Short Post this Time Date: Fri, 09 Apr 1999 23:51:15 +0000 From: Tony Stubblefield or Dean Meredith To: David Collins/Weavers Words Susan Tripp - I'm sure it is very annoying, but it is really funny too. I am always amazed at how bold people can be sometimes! Sandy - I agree with you whole heartedly on rib basket spokes and how close they should be to each other. The more spokes you add the smoother the curve of the basket can be. Gretchen - The only time I painted a handle on a basket what when I had really screwed it up and need a way to hid my mistake. It ended up looking pretty good. I think I painted it dark green and painted a couple of hearts on each side about the rim. I have thought about staining a notched handle a dark color, like cherry, before inserting it and then staining the entire basket with a lighter color. I use real cherry wood on some of my Shaker baskets and like the look so I thought I might try to simulate it on a reed basket. If you try this before I get a chance let me know how it looks. Tony Stubblefield St. Louis http://www.tetranet.net/users/deanandtony/baskets.htm %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%% Subject: Some things just have to be said! Date: Fri, 9 Apr 1999 23:36:54 -0400 From: "mkoch" To: Pam Feix: A lot of work goes into a convention. Several IBA members spend several hours, weeks and sometimes months working to pull everything together so that the attendees have a positive experience. This year the Adams Mark staff worked extremely hard, and put in long hours, to see that the IBA convention came off as smooth as possible. When there was a problem, big or small, the Adams Mark staff was right there to resolve any and all situations. Luckily, due to the detailed planning and hard work of Carolyn Black (the coordinator) and her helpers, there were few problems, and the convention was a hit. The hotel provided the food carts at Carolyn's request. And from what we heard from many attendees, they were a big hit, as well as, a convenience (as they were intended to be.) Vendors were provided a map of local fast food restaurants and a pizza delivery number for their convenience, just incase, the hotel restaurant lines were too long or if hotel food was not to their liking. I am sorry to hear that your $4.50 hotel hamburger experience was a disappointing one. By the way, $4.50 for a HOTEL hamburger is a fair price, good or bad. Maybe you should have returned the hamburger to the food cart server, as I am sure they would have allowed you to make another selection or returned your money. In the future, if there is a problem please bring it to the attention of the hotel staff (as they have requested that we do) , and give them the opportunity to make it right. Good luck next time. Jim & Diane Langston: Good for you! Some things just have to be said!!!!! Bye for now Dollie %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%% Subject: Re: "Weavers Words" V. 2 I. 109 Date: Sat, 10 Apr 1999 09:20:23 -0400 From: jbenner@juno.com To: davidc@iei.net HI All, Thanks for all this advice re: the poison ivy. It is leaving my body via my fingertips now, thank goodness! I haven't found the Ruhligel (sp?) yet Angie and Donna. Any suggestions as to a store name? I'm going by phonetic pronunciation not spelling. Trouble with it being on the hands now is that they are rarely dry. Remember I clean houses for a living, and then weaving your hands are wet a lot (at least mine are) and I always seem to have my hands in water. I find it's least bothersome when my hands are cool and dry. Lesley, I'll tell ya' from now on I don't care how many leaves anything has, I'm leaving it alone!!! All this trouble and my son goes and rips the vegetation out with his truck after all.... sheesh.... Lois, You aren't doing anything wrong I don't think I am either, nor is it regional. Re: the rims. I find it easier to shave the rims when they are dry. I too use the Stanley shaver, but it seems to get gunkier faster when the FO is wet than dry. My teacher found this to be true also. I was always doing it wet, and hated it, then one night I did it dry and commented to her about how much easier it seemed. That's when she mentioned she too had trouble shaving these when wet. I have a question for all of you who do shave these by hand. Power tools don't count. Where on earth do you do this? I am almost assuming you guys have a workbench somewhere. It's dangerous to do that on a kitchen table, counter, dining room table, etc. AS I pull, the reed moves, the shaver moves and oftimes I find I am shaving what the reed is resting on. I tried it on my deck, and ended up making marks. Now I've been doing it on my brick porch wall. This may be dulling the blade though when I miss. You know, you lay it was flat as you can, but as you swipe across, and more and more comes off, your edges of the shaver tend to scrape whatever is under the reed. Any thoughts? Just one more reason to use flat reed to rim.... Donna L. and Pam Woodbury, Yes, I think it is more the adults than the kids that like the basket demo idea. I came in at the middle of yesterdays talk from the police officer. Several children were removed for being obnoxious, and a couple were falling asleep. The funniest was, when the officer asked if any of the kids had been down to see the jail a couple kids were raising their hands going "oh yes, my daddy's been in jail"... they were most proud of this! I don't know how the officer answered that. They were so cute and earnest in their replies. Juanita in Baltimore, Yes, yes, I'll admit to buying handles for a project and then forgetting what they are for. So, I now mark lightly on the price tag what it's intended use is. I just this past Christmas made a basket for the next door neighbor, and used a 10" notched handle which I thought was an "extra". Hah! I have no extras, and found out when I went to make the step basket in Jan. for a friend that that was the intended use for that handle. Had to run out to the Country Seat to get another. Now I mark them. Well, time to get to work on something besides this computer. It's 9:15 am already!! Judy in sunny (if not warm) Pa. %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%% Subject: Re: "Weavers Words" V. 2 I. 110 Date: Sat, 10 Apr 1999 08:09:02 -0700 From: Naomi Paquette To: David Collins References: 1 Hi David, You are really keeping us busy at our computers lately, keep up the great work. Carolyn Black re: Winnies reed in dryer. Winnie, I must have missed your part in WW where you talked about dyed reed in the dryer. I have put reed in the washer to dye it. I put the dye and the reed in swirl it around a few times and let it sit all day if necessary to get the desired color. Of course the first time I did it I worried about the washing machine never being the same but after I got through I put washing liquid and bleach in the washer and a few cleaning clothes and ran a load and it was fine. I really was in a hurry and needed a lot of reed for my class. If anyone dares they should try it. You can dye clothes in the washer why not reed Huh? Another thing I have done is taken dyed reed, like dark blue and put it in the top of the dishwasher and ran a short cycle. It gives it a denim look. These are things I have tried and I don't want anyone blaming me if they destroy their appliances. Try at your own risk. Alice Edwards in the Kansas City Area, bending flat reed. Thanks Alice for your tips on flat reed, I do most of the things you talked about but my students asked me to research the subject on WW, because so many good tips come from here. They thought someone else may have a solution that I had thought of or tried. They were right. Thanks again. Naomi in Hot Sunny Florida, to hot to soon, hope all of you in the north and northwest, are enjoying some nice weather as well. All the robins are gone, they must be snowbirds also. %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%% Subject: Bits and Pieces Date: Sat, 10 Apr 1999 10:35:24, -0500 From: BDKE97B@prodigy.com (MRS BILLIE A DORRIS) To: davidc@iei.net Have you ever noticed that in some issues there is nothing that you feel you need to respond to and then the next one has a million that you should. So here goes. Judy Lanier: All I can do is quote the waitress on the 10-10-321 commercial "you've got to quit drinking before breakfast" when you comment on how nice I am. Those who know me well would think you've lost your mind, or maybe I'm just on my best behavior at convention (what best behavior). You better watch for that lightning strike. Thought the comment about making a basket as a gift because you wanted to, helped get you out of your slump. I had never thought about it before but I think you're right. I would love to be able to just weave baskets for those who appreciate them and I do think I would me more enthused if I could. On the "L" subject. In this weeks People magazine there are 2 letters to the editor from "L" people. I guess at the Oscars the participants were given gift baskets "L"'s filled with about $10,000 worth of goodies but when people showed an example they didn't use an "L" but something else. The person was highly offended that the basket was a poor imitation of an "L". Anyway next time you are standing in the checkout line have a look at the letters (in the brat pack issue). I also agree with the person that said how much Dave had done for the town and think it's important- just wish that folks didn't think of them as an investment. When you search for basket on ebay the majority of hits are "L"'s and some of the prices make me want to cry. I agree about not complaining about the people who volunteered at the conventions, I didn't mean that at all. My complaints were about the attitude of the hotel staff. If we had never been there before it would be more understandable and they didn't know what to expect but they should have known this time. Now in defense of all of the math impaired people. Those of you who aren't among us just really don't understand that it just isn't that easy to "figure" out all the things that must be taken into consideration when changing the size of a basket or the materials. Although I can do it after all these years it still is a struggle for me. Last year one of our members who teaches 8th grade math gave a talk "downsizing" baskets. As she is a good friend of mine I think she just got fed up with me not understanding. I still don't understand the theory behind it but I now know that if you cut all the sizes in half you end up with a basket that is 1/4 of the original. One of the examples she uses in class is the amount in different sizes of pizza. the kids understand that an 8" doesn't' give half the amount of a 16". The discussion has reminded me of the time I took a class in how to play the dulcimer that I had built (in another life time before baskets) and I told someone that I was having trouble tuning the thing. A grade school music teacher turned around to me and said "just tune it in the key of g ". I thought to myself that TUNING IT TO G WAS THE PROBLEM. . I also thought that I was glad I wasn't in her class at school if she didn't understand that some people had difficulty with that. One last thing. Last week I had something happen that I had always wondered about. I always glue my rims to the Nantucket's before I nail them-just my preference-as I was a bit concerned that it could come off if just nailed. Especially with cane staves as the nail sometimes splits the spoke(even with pre-drilling). so anyway I was finishing the purse I took at convention and was shaping the hinges(already on the basket) I looked down and part of the basket had come out from under the rim. Talk about panic. I did get it back on without having to take it apart and start over but it has made me think. What do other Nant. folks do? I perform the rim and then glue it to the basket at the same time as I glue the scarf(starting in the middle and working both ways to the overlap) . I usually form the rim right over the basket while it's still on the mold. It gives me a pretty tight fit. I have actually gotten pretty good about the final sanding of the scarf when it is already on the basket. Anyway, any advice? Okay-enough from me for now. Billie from cold rainy Va. Beach %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%% Subject: Re: arrowmont Date: Sat, 10 Apr 1999 12:00:21 -0400 From: "Mary Hooper" To: "David Collins" Gosh, Billie Dorris, I'd love to be at arrowmont, but my sister didn't bother to check with me before making her reservations for a trip to the old sod, England. Our aged father is going with her and coming back with me and wouldn't you know, his 45 day return time frame puts Arrowmont in the wrong darn weekend! Next year, I'll send her a copy of my schedule and she can work around my plans. While in England, I plan to look for the institute for the blind, where they make baskets. And to go to Walkley's Clog Mill where they not only still make wooden clogs--be still, my heart,[has anyone bought a pair of Dr. Scholl's with the piddley soft sole covering they now use? :-( ] but they have a 4-story mill with 30 specialty craft and retail outlets. I'll be looking for baskets. If anyone has been to Walkley's I'd appreciate comments. Has anyone else found, as I have, that one has to go out of one's way to search out crafters in England? Any tips would be gratefully accepted. Billie, I missed you at NCBA--maybe another time? I enjoy your postings and would like to meet you. Jennalee, your patterns are on the way. Now, I really am going back to bed. Could I have picked up this intestinal virus from NCBA, despite going outside to the parking garage a lot? I vote for (midi) conventions held in places where the air is natural. We have a number of places here in the mountains, such as Montreat. Ridgecrest, and Lake Junaluska. All the best to all you happy weavers from one miserable one. Mary Hooper %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%% Subject: responce to Pam Feix Date: Sat, 10 Apr 1999 13:59:32 -0400 From: James & Diane Langston Organization: Di's Heaveny Treasures To: davidc@iei.net David, please one more time, I just have a few more things to say and then I will go about my life, and know that I did all that I could do To make a difference....Diane To Pam Feix: I got your post.. Again, this is America and we all have the right to speak our mind. I too do not want any conflict between us, in my own small way I am trying with God's help to change things. I will be as as kind as I can to set you straight on my comment about "The Promise" that you are selling on your web page. This is of course where I saw it . I did not make a reference to your weaving ability on any other basket but my own.. That is why I spoke, your basket was not made like mine and I did not want my name attached to a basket that is not made the way I represent it and then priced below me. I was in the process of having our own web site done. It was here that I was going to offer our own original designed finished baskets. Of course I was upset that you had the finished ark at a lower price.(This is why it would have been considerate to ask) I have never had a problem selling my, "The Promise" at twice the price. This hurts the designers of the baskets. Try to understand here, when you sell someone else's basket way cheaper than the designer don't you think that is wrong? If it is your own original design you can do that . But the whole issue here is we have lost respect for the original pattern writers, our vendors, our teachers and our basket association in general. Why couldn't you have asked the originators for their permission to sell their basket on your web page? And then kept your selling price in line with theirs? Oh, it may be legal to do it your way but it IS NOT ETHICAL! You say you came into this business and asked and checked how things were done, and concluded that their was no right way and no wrong. way. But here is the point I am trying to make and it seems you and others, are not getting it. Because things were done this way, as you called it a "common business practice" does not make it right! As the years have gone by, little by little we tell ourselves that this is alright and we have lost the ability to discern right from wrong. It would have been ethical had you contacted me on your plans to market "The Promise" and kept your prices in line with mine, this would at least have given me a chance to approve or disapprove, and let you know my feelings on the subject. On your comments earlier, you gave reference to the quality of the food that was served at the IBA convention, and you believed that it was important to speak out so that you could hopefully change things. How is this issue any different? Isn't this issue more important than a hamburger? This is what we have become! When did we loose our compassion for others for the work that they do, just to take it and add a new color , add an inch in height or width, and call it our own. Do we even know what the word original means? Don't we care anymore??? But look, copying is because we think there is nothing new in basketry? The sky is the limit if you would all tap in to your own creativity, God will help you, for He honors a right spirit and attitude. Let's bring basketry back to the art it used to be. It could be a wonderful thing to hand down to the next generation of weavers.. You will not put me out of business, God put me in and He will take me out, if He chooses. We have been here to give and share our original ideas. If I go I'll go happily, pleased to do His will. We wish you the best and do not begrudge you anything. All I ask is that from now on you will remember all the things that have been spoken of here and will think your choices through. If there is to be a change we can all make it happen a little at a time. Now let us listen to all the ones who write in. I think they can take it from here. The opinions will probably vary, however each of us can make our own choices on where we will stand, I just hope that some of you are helped and I apologize if I have hurt anyone, but the truth is still the truth, and after all that is what sets us free! Thank you David for a place to express our feelings and concerns. And thank you all for the letters and calls of support, you touched us. God Bless................Jim & Diane "Di's Heavenly Treasures" %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%% Subject: First bicycle basket Date: Sat, 10 Apr 1999 11:40:07 -0700 From: "lisa mcdaniels" To: Hello, my name is Helen and I am trying to find who invented the bicycle basket. If you have any information and if you have the time, can you send any information that you may have to: lmcdaniels@aol.com Thank you for you time and assistance %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%% If for any you would ever like to cancel your subscription, simply send me a message with "unsubscribe" as your subject.